Accident damage to f/o/s suspension - steering??

Chat about your facelift 9n3 Polo - Including the 9N3 Polo GTI!
Post Reply
polodad27
New
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2018 11:39 am
Drives: 2007 9N3
Location: bourne lincolnshire

Accident damage to f/o/s suspension - steering??

Post by polodad27 »

Hi, Further to my last post regarding OSF suspension damage on my sons 2007 9N3, i have still not bottomed out the problem; i fitted a code reader and they only thing it indicated was a problem with the crank position sensor, nothing related to the non functioning power steering. On doing some on line research i came across a couple of references to similar damage tripping the side impact air bag resulting in the power steering not working, one owner changed the sensor under the seat and the control unit under the dash on the top of the trans tunnel, and it re set, and another case the owner turned the ignition key on and off a few times and whispered a spell and it re set the steering??? what is the link between the two?? is it the electronics?? some sort of safety feature?? i have fitted a new sensor which goes under the seat and an exact matching control box (side airbag) to go under the centre of the dash, which i bought secondhand from a non damaged car, however i am reluctant to re connect the battery in case there is something else i should consider or do before i do so and mess it up. I have re built the suspension and the wheel is obviously out of alignment pending the tracking being done, could it be a sensor picking up the fact the steering is way out and shutting down the power assist?? Any help here would be greatly appreciated to help get my son back on the road. Many thanks. John
RUM4MO
Bling Bling Diamond Member
Posts: 5859
Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 9:12 pm
Drives: B8 S4 & 6R/6C1 1.2TSI 110
Location: Mid Lothian

Re: Accident damage to f/o/s suspension - steering??

Post by RUM4MO »

Not trying to be smart or stupid, but which code reader are you using, what I am getting at is, most generic code reader only cover OBD2 engine codes and even then mainly only codes that cover/cause emissions issues.

To read/reveal steering or most other controllers you will need a better code reader or even VCDS.

Edit:- from casual exposure to these problems on these forums, there does seem to be a bit of a correlation between accident damage and the electro/hydraulic power steering assembly failing, more than that I can't say - why air bag activation should have an intended effect on this does seem crazy - but?
Last edited by RUM4MO on Mon Nov 26, 2018 11:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
polodad27
New
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2018 11:39 am
Drives: 2007 9N3
Location: bourne lincolnshire

Re: Accident damage to f/o/s suspension - steering??

Post by polodad27 »

Thanks RUM4MO, you are correct, i only have access to an OBD2 code reader, all this plug in and program technology on engines and other components is beyond me i am afraid, i am old school and have a decent proper tool kit if you know what i mean which is why i am struggling to help my lad who is an impoverished student get back on the road.
Does anyone know if there is a mechanism which detects the wheels are not straight with the steering wheel and shuts down the power steering??? is it a matter of struggling to drive it to the garage for the tracking to be sorted and then somehow re setting the control unit?? I cant see a hydraulic pump?? electro hydraulic??, or any leaks from the power steering fluid container or any outwardly visible damage to the rack or hoses. I did replace the track rod and the track rod end bearing hence the wheel is not tracking as it should be at the moment.
Many thanks.
John
RUM4MO
Bling Bling Diamond Member
Posts: 5859
Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 9:12 pm
Drives: B8 S4 & 6R/6C1 1.2TSI 110
Location: Mid Lothian

Re: Accident damage to f/o/s suspension - steering??

Post by RUM4MO »

The pump with its electric motor - direct driven, and the steering power controller, is located below the fluid reservoir and can be seen by removing the LHS front wheel wheel arch liner - or taking off the front bumper.

As for modern day fancy car electronic systems, having a good diagnostic tool works wonders and you would soon get the hang of it, well only as much as you needed to know by using it! Now that all depends on if you are a "VW Group family" - if you have a mix of car marques in your family unless you get a hugely expensive garage workshop level diagnostic tool you will have problems. We, as a family seemed to drift towards being a "VW Group family" and so I bought VCDS which paid for itself the first time I used it as I had done a personal import of a brand new VW Passat 4Motion in 2000 - discovered that winter that windscreen low fluid warning system had not been enabled nor had the brake wear warning system, maybe this was because it was supplied via a Dutch VW dealership, so I asked my local VW dealer if he could sort that out for me - " not possible you need to buy a completely new dash pod and we can program it and fit it, that will be around £600!" - and that was back in late 2000, so I dug deep got VAG-COM as a Christmas present and sorted that out quickly by recoding the dash pod. Wife then moved to VW when we imported a brand new Polo 1.4 16V SE in 2002, and older daughter started buying SEAT Ibizas! Now, when my wife bought her second new Polo 1.2TSI 110PS SEL in 2015, she got the usual marketing questionnaire from VW, one of the questions was "why did you chose to buy a VW?" I answered that questionnaire for her, and the answer to that question was "because my husband has VCDS" - which really says it all, right now, when you buy a car you are lost and at the mercy of dealerships when lots of things go wrong, you can put yourself back in control most of the time by having a high quality diagnostic tool.

Just in case you are new to VW Group cars, and other marques might have this issue as well, when you get a brake light failure in a Polo etc, or any other VW without a bulb failure device fitted, lots of lights can on on the dashboard and maybe even "limp home" engine mode is activated, if you don't know anything about this, or the brake light light on the brake pedal fails, which they do often, then you need to call on the services of a VW Group dealer and they initially hit you with the standard diagnostics charge, then replace maybe only a single brake light bulb - very nasty!
polodad27
New
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2018 11:39 am
Drives: 2007 9N3
Location: bourne lincolnshire

Re: Accident damage to f/o/s suspension - steering??

Post by polodad27 »

Thanks again RUM4MO i suppose we are a vw family in that we also have a Sharan TDI which i bought new back in 2005, still going but looking a bit sorry for itself with 165000 miles and having looked after a family of six for most of those miles, Mcdonalds, sweets, spilled drinks, runs to the rubbish tip, you get the picture!
I am not sure it is worth the investment for me buying a VCDS kit as i am not sure how to interpret the results or program it etc.
Well yesterday i fitted the new side airbag control box and 'new' sensor under the seat and connected up and guess what? no change, air bag light still on as is the power steering warning light and no power steering!!
I am rapidly losing patience and it looks like we are off to the nearest expensive garage.
Cheers.
John
RUM4MO
Bling Bling Diamond Member
Posts: 5859
Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 9:12 pm
Drives: B8 S4 & 6R/6C1 1.2TSI 110
Location: Mid Lothian

Re: Accident damage to f/o/s suspension - steering??

Post by RUM4MO »

To be honest, based on what I think/know, I don't think that you can just dive in a swop things like that, that new controller might need to be "paired" to the existing airbags etc - though I could just be wrong there.

I think that your plan to cut to the end game and hand it over to a good VAG Indie garage or at worst a VW dealer will cost a bit but stop you spending good money badly with good intentions - that really is where things like VCDS help - ie you find something that you might be able to sort out and head straight for it and fix the problem, or you find something that you can't and head for professional help.

Edit:- of course the other possibility could be that if either of these "new" parts are not brand new, ie they have come from a write off, they too might have logged airbag incidents so either need scanned and cleared of stored faults or are now scrap. Some lesser controllers when disconnected from 12V supply will have all their stored faults erased, but I think some important controllers like airbag controllers and/or crash sensors do not.
polodad27
New
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2018 11:39 am
Drives: 2007 9N3
Location: bourne lincolnshire

Re: Airbag control module 'WIPING' - HELP PLEASE

Post by polodad27 »

Hello again, the saga to get my lads 9N3 back on the road continues!! The car has had two pairs of secondhand side air bag sensors and air bag control units installed from non crash damaged cars, and two visits to a VW garage for diagnostics the first revealed that the first replacement side sensor was defective - from printout "communication error between crash sensor G-130 and airbag control module J-234, vehicle requires replacement sensor and potentially new module" this info cost £70.00
To be on the safe side a second pair was purchased and today the car was plugged in to the diagnostic computer at the same garage, this time the sensor was ok but when the technician tried to code the control module the following readout was printed - "Coding not possible! The control module has already been coded. (to another car) Coding is only possible with a new control module J234 1C0909605K" A new module is £431.48!! not sure if that's plus VAT! but in any case i can't get one as there are none in stock in the world and if i wanted one i am informed it would have to go on back order to VW Germany.
The very helpful service manager informed me in hushed tones that you can get your module "wiped" by suitably equipped and knowledgeable people, my question here is, does any one know of such a person or company who can wipe my lads airbag control module please and a contact name address and the likely cost of such a service? the VW service manager states that if i return with a suitably wiped module then he will code it, VW can not wipe them he says but as they have none in stock to supply me with, he will sort it if i return with it wiped.
PLEASE DOES ANYONE KNOW WHERE I CAN GET THIS DONE PLEASE?? the illuminated air bag light on the dash is the only item stopping us from getting the car back on the road.
Thank you
polodad27
New
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2018 11:39 am
Drives: 2007 9N3
Location: bourne lincolnshire

Re: Accident damage to f/o/s suspension - steering??

Post by polodad27 »

Further to my last post - i have found a company to do the reset. Regards
RUM4MO
Bling Bling Diamond Member
Posts: 5859
Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 9:12 pm
Drives: B8 S4 & 6R/6C1 1.2TSI 110
Location: Mid Lothian

Re: Accident damage to f/o/s suspension - steering??

Post by RUM4MO »

I missed that other posting, but good, out of interest where of what sort of company is "decoding" that module for you, as it might be handy for others in the future?

I'd think that proper ECU remanufacturing companies like BBA-REMAN could provide that service by mail.

VW Group do carry that sort of operation out on more modern cars as quite a lot of modules have "Component Protection" and they need to be returned to being "virgin units" - ie like new and unused, before they can be added to another car, and that info is held my VW Group mothership as well as the car it has been accepted into, I got a good Indie VW Group garage to do that for me for my Audi S4 when I swopped a good non DAB radio for a used but hopefully good DAB radio, and that worked fine.
Post Reply