More power Remap or tuning box (250hp)

Chat about your 2018+ AW/BZ model Polos here!
shiloh
New
Posts: 7
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2018 10:20 pm
Drives: 2018 Polo Gti
Location: Aberdeen

More power Remap or tuning box (250hp)

Post by shiloh »

Now the car is mostly run in at 1000miles I'm toying with the idea of getting more power out the gti with a remap or something. So far I have only found one company doing them through a tuning box and they recon about 250hp https://tdi-tuning.com/car/volkswagen/p ... rrency=GBP

Does anyone else know of any others doing remaps or tuning boxes?

Also would a tuning box void the warranty. Would they ever know as you could remove it before putting the car in
Dark_cze
Silver Member
Posts: 437
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 5:14 pm
Drives: AW GTI with MT
Location: Czech republic

Re: More power Remap or tuning box (250hp)

Post by Dark_cze »

They say it is for "Polo GTI 197 BHP / 200 PS / 147 KW / 280 NM / 207 LBFT" new generation GTI have 320 NM if Iam right
PoloBlueGT
Bronze Member
Posts: 180
Joined: Sun Mar 13, 2016 6:12 pm
Drives: Landrover Freelander
Location: Manchester

Re: More power Remap or tuning box (250hp)

Post by PoloBlueGT »

Everything seems right but most places do state 320nm
monkeyhanger
Bling Bling Diamond Member
Posts: 2643
Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2018 9:58 pm
Drives: Audi A4 Avant Quattro 40 TDI, Polo GTI+
Location: Newcastle upon Tyne

Re: More power Remap or tuning box (250hp)

Post by monkeyhanger »

I would give "TDI-Tuning" a wide berth. I got a tuning box from them for my MK7 Golf GTD. They were the first ones out there advertising that they had a box for that car, so I ordered one.

It was obvious that the car was being massively overfuelled at all times, my actual mpg was terrible and my DPF was actively regenerating most of the time. Power delivery was savage/unrefined. Put your foot down in 3rd 50-70mph and you would generate wheelspin - not because of so much extra power, but because of the rough way it was delivered. I suffered it a week and then requested a fix or a refund. I sent it back and their "fix" was to half the adaptations, so adding very little extra in torque and power, so it was pointless.

I stayed away from the tuning boxes for 4 months until DTUK brought one out. They were local to me, so I paid a visit and tried before I bought. It was amazing. It was smooth in its power delivery, did not adversely affect real mpg, the DPF regenerated much less frequently than stock and to put the improvements into context, the car pulled in 6th like stock power does in 4th. 240ish ps and about 510Nm vs stock 184ps and 380Nm.

If you want a tuning box, i'd probably go DTUK. There are a few decent remapping companies out there, Revo and Bluefin are probably 2 of the best known brands out there. Not sure if anyone has gone to the bother of developing a remap for the pre-WLTP Polo GTI that anyone here with a GTI will have right now. In the longer term there will be far fewer non GPF GTIs than those with. It was speculated that the Polo GTI could be boosted easily to 250ps/400Nm without upgrading any components. Tuning boxes do have the advantage that they do hold some resale value as a physical unit that can be transferred to another car

My Polo GTI+ is my first DSG equipped VW. I have a Golf R also, with manual gearbox, but I wouldn't dare remap that because the manual box's clutch is so weak - pretty much everyone on the Golf GTI forum who's remapped their MK7 Golf GTI or R has experienced clutch slip. The DSG box handles the increase in power and torque much better. Not sure if it truly handles the power better or whether it backs off via the torque limiter when too much is going through it.


These tuning box companies will tell you that you can increase the mpg by up to 20%. Indicated mpg will certainly increase, because the car is fooled into thinking it is using less fuel vs throttle response than it actually is. The basic 2 channel boxes usually connect to the MAF and the fuel injection system e.g. the common rail sensor on a TDI, and the petrol versions need an independent electrical supply.

So if they can up power 20% and not affect mpg that much, why don't VW set the cars up like that? The tuning companies don't have to consider component longevity or emissions compliance. With the DTUK box on my GTD, it was running around 4C hotter than stock for any given load - that means more NOx, but also better soot combustion in the DPF which is now running hotter all the time. Particulates vs NOx is a balancing act in an engine that runs relatively hot like a TDI or a very small displacement direct injection petrol unit (like the 1.0TSI).
PoloBlueGT
Bronze Member
Posts: 180
Joined: Sun Mar 13, 2016 6:12 pm
Drives: Landrover Freelander
Location: Manchester

Re: More power Remap or tuning box (250hp)

Post by PoloBlueGT »

Hang on monkeyhanger have you ran this past silverhairs for approval :wink:
shiloh
New
Posts: 7
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2018 10:20 pm
Drives: 2018 Polo Gti
Location: Aberdeen

Re: More power Remap or tuning box (250hp)

Post by shiloh »

Thanks a lot for the info. I had revo do my mk4 golf 1.8t and that thing was amazing once it settled in. Not sure what to make of these tuning boxes. Will keep having a look. I saw a lot of mixed reviews about TDI tuning so will give them a swerve. Just looking at options that will let me keep my warranty.

You mentioned WLTP and GPF. What are they and how do you know what version you have? Mine is a 68 plate and the salesman said it was compliant with the new regs
monkeyhanger
Bling Bling Diamond Member
Posts: 2643
Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2018 9:58 pm
Drives: Audi A4 Avant Quattro 40 TDI, Polo GTI+
Location: Newcastle upon Tyne

Re: More power Remap or tuning box (250hp)

Post by monkeyhanger »

shiloh wrote: Thu Oct 04, 2018 10:38 pm Thanks a lot for the info. I had revo do my mk4 golf 1.8t and that thing was amazing once it settled in. Not sure what to make of these tuning boxes. Will keep having a look. I saw a lot of mixed reviews about TDI tuning so will give them a swerve. Just looking at options that will let me keep my warranty.

You mentioned WLTP and GPF. What are they and how do you know what version you have? Mine is a 68 plate and the salesman said it was compliant with the new regs
I was under the impression that there were no GPF (gasoline particulate filters - direct injection petrol cars produce soot in meaningful quantities) equipped Polo GTIs being made until November this year, but if yours is on a 68 plate and is fully WLTP compliant rather than being registered as a 68 plate under regulation concession because it just missed getting to the dealership within the pre-WLTP deadline, you will have a GPF.

WLTP is the new worldwide standard testing cycle that is supposed to regulate real life driving so you don't get unachieveable claims for mpg and emissions. Of course only a select number of countries will comply - the Yanks won't give up their 3 tone pick-ups with v8 lumps just yet!


I don't think there's an undetectable bhp increasing tuning option out there right now. DTUK have some DSG tuning box solution that plugs in and flashes via the OBD port that they claim is undetectable. It apparently increases torque handling capabilities and speeds up gear changes.
Dan34
Getting There!
Posts: 93
Joined: Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:54 am
Drives: GTI+
Location: UK

Re: More power Remap or tuning box (250hp)

Post by Dan34 »

JB1/4 will be the one to go for when it’s released, might be already not checked. That will tap into the AFR so can get really good results and runs pretty safe. Had one on my golf R and worked very well, the mobile app is good too if you have the Bluetooth module for it. Fully removable and untraceable too which is nice. Also the support from Burger Motosports who develop them is top notch.
monkeyhanger
Bling Bling Diamond Member
Posts: 2643
Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2018 9:58 pm
Drives: Audi A4 Avant Quattro 40 TDI, Polo GTI+
Location: Newcastle upon Tyne

Re: More power Remap or tuning box (250hp)

Post by monkeyhanger »

Dan34 wrote: Sat Oct 06, 2018 2:05 pm JB1/4 will be the one to go for when it’s released, might be already not checked. That will tap into the AFR so can get really good results and runs pretty safe. Had one on my golf R and worked very well, the mobile app is good too if you have the Bluetooth module for it. Fully removable and untraceable too which is nice. Also the support from Burger Motosports who develop them is top notch.
Are they still considered to be untraceable Dan? It used to be considered that they were not traceable, then a different school of thought came about that they weren't directly traceable, but certain signals can be interpreted as manipulation by a tuning box, such as boost limits and other data which throws up implausible readings compared to those expected as stock. Detectability is supposed to be a case of how deep the VW technicians look to find it - take it in for a service, with no fault codes and they won't look too hard. Take it in for a warranty claim because something has been playing up that is related to the stock map, then scrutiny will find it.


I wouldn't bet my life on it being absolutely true, as I haven't heard of someone being denied warranty in the MK7 Golf forums for being suspected of having had a tuning box on at some point, but there's been a lot of speculation on the subject from knowledgeable forum users who are very up to speed with interpreting ECU data generation and fault codes.


I would have one tomorrow if I could be assured that it was untraceable. Looks like Burger's own website has no info on a new Polo GTI 2.0TSI solution yet, but the last 1.8TSI Polo GTI is catered for.
mike sel
Silver Member
Posts: 482
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2018 11:16 am
Drives: SEL
Location: Dorset

Re: More power Remap or tuning box (250hp)

Post by mike sel »

PoloBlueGT wrote: Thu Oct 04, 2018 10:34 pm Hang on monkeyhanger have you ran this past silverhairs for approval :wink:
Funny :D everyone's blocked silverhairs haven't they? :lol: :!: :!: :!: :!:
Dan34
Getting There!
Posts: 93
Joined: Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:54 am
Drives: GTI+
Location: UK

Re: More power Remap or tuning box (250hp)

Post by Dan34 »

monkeyhanger wrote: Sat Oct 06, 2018 10:55 pm
Dan34 wrote: Sat Oct 06, 2018 2:05 pm JB1/4 will be the one to go for when it’s released, might be already not checked. That will tap into the AFR so can get really good results and runs pretty safe. Had one on my golf R and worked very well, the mobile app is good too if you have the Bluetooth module for it. Fully removable and untraceable too which is nice. Also the support from Burger Motosports who develop them is top notch.
Are they still considered to be untraceable Dan? It used to be considered that they were not traceable, then a different school of thought came about that they weren't directly traceable, but certain signals can be interpreted as manipulation by a tuning box, such as boost limits and other data which throws up implausible readings compared to those expected as stock. Detectability is supposed to be a case of how deep the VW technicians look to find it - take it in for a service, with no fault codes and they won't look too hard. Take it in for a warranty claim because something has been playing up that is related to the stock map, then scrutiny will find it.


I wouldn't bet my life on it being absolutely true, as I haven't heard of someone being denied warranty in the MK7 Golf forums for being suspected of having had a tuning box on at some point, but there's been a lot of speculation on the subject from knowledgeable forum users who are very up to speed with interpreting ECU data generation and fault codes.


I would have one tomorrow if I could be assured that it was untraceable. Looks like Burger's own website has no info on a new Polo GTI 2.0TSI solution yet, but the last 1.8TSI Polo GTI is catered for.
I wouldn’t trust anything to be untraceable like you say but I think it’s much harder to detect something like the JB4 being there once removed compared to a remap. I’ve not come across any posts of someone being caught running a JB4 in the past on their car when taking it to a dealer yet, not to say it hasn’t happened though! I prefer the JB4 method to a Remap because you have something physical to sell at the end and is easy to roll back to stock if you’re not happy with it etc. I know a ‘proper’ remap will give better gains though usually.
silverhairs
Gold Member
Posts: 686
Joined: Sun May 13, 2018 1:15 pm
Drives: 2018 Polo SEL
Location: Lincolnshire

Re: More power Remap or tuning box (250hp)

Post by silverhairs »

mike sel wrote: Sun Oct 07, 2018 6:30 am
PoloBlueGT wrote: Thu Oct 04, 2018 10:34 pm Hang on monkeyhanger have you ran this past silverhairs for approval :wink:
Funny :D everyone's blocked silverhairs haven't they? :lol: :!: :!: :!: :!:
I'll treat this post with the contempt it deserves.
mike sel
Silver Member
Posts: 482
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2018 11:16 am
Drives: SEL
Location: Dorset

Re: More power Remap or tuning box (250hp)

Post by mike sel »

I don't think I will tune the car I have I do think they can be wound up too much. the 115 is as far as I think its reasonable to push a 1.0 l engine. I know Ford somehow get 125hp out of it and some say up to 135 by I think that's pushing it, I don't know anything about modern engines so I am basing my opinion on nothing more then common sense? conservative thinking? If im wrong in my conservative approach let me know someone. By the way if we block people we cant read their posts so its kind of a waste of time posting a reply to me if I have blocked you, Ive only blocked one troll in my life and im pleased I have.
shiloh
New
Posts: 7
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2018 10:20 pm
Drives: 2018 Polo Gti
Location: Aberdeen

Re: More power Remap or tuning box (250hp)

Post by shiloh »

Have never heard of JB1/4 but will have a wee look and see what google draggs up. These engines should be good to well over 250Hp safely going by the specs and the usaul VW margin that they add into their engines. Recon the limiting factor will probubly be the gearbox, not sure what that'll top out at torque wise but as far as i know its a wet clutch gearbox and if so it should be much more resiliant, torque limiter will probubly also save anyone doing anything too rediculous to it.

Just need to now find out if there is a way of doing it that VW will never be able to tell :twisted:
TElwoody
Bronze Member
Posts: 118
Joined: Mon May 07, 2018 11:35 pm
Drives: VW Polo 2018
Location: Cardiff

Re: More power Remap or tuning box (250hp)

Post by TElwoody »

mike sel wrote: Sun Oct 07, 2018 1:37 pm I don't think I will tune the car I have I do think they can be wound up too much. the 115 is as far as I think its reasonable to push a 1.0 l engine. I know Ford somehow get 125hp out of it and some say up to 135 by I think that's pushing it, I don't know anything about modern engines so I am basing my opinion on nothing more then common sense? conservative thinking? If im wrong in my conservative approach let me know someone. By the way if we block people we cant read their posts so its kind of a waste of time posting a reply to me if I have blocked you, Ive only blocked one troll in my life and im pleased I have.
Yeah, i think 115 is enough for the 1 litres. Alot of the higher HP 1 Litre ford engines are going bang or on fire. Loads of problems with them.
Post Reply