GTI and WRC rims

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BlackBetty
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GTI and WRC rims

Post by BlackBetty »

Hi, did anyone fit the genuine WRC wheels with tire size 215/35/18 on the new Polo GTI 2.0? If so, would you be so kind to post some pictures? I wonder whether this tire size will look decent since the optional 18 Brescia's are equipped with 215/40/18 tires?

Thank you all for your input, BlackBetty
Last edited by BlackBetty on Wed Jan 16, 2019 7:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
monkeyhanger
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Re: GTI and WRC rims

Post by monkeyhanger »

BlackBetty wrote: Tue Jan 15, 2019 6:46 pm Hi, did everyone fit the genuine WRC wheels with tire size 215/35/18 on the new Polo GTI 2.0? If so, would you be so kind to post some pictures? I wonder whether this tire size will look decent since the optional 18 Brescia's are equipped with 215/40/18 tires?

Thank you all for your input, BlackBetty
If you fit those tyres, you're effectively lowering the gearing by 5% as the rolling circumference will be 5% lower for a 215/35 R18 tyre vs 215/40 R18 tyre. Are you not liking the 40 tyrewall height?
SRGTD
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Re: GTI and WRC rims

Post by SRGTD »

It’d be worth checking the load rating of the WRC wheels that were fitted to the previous generation Polo WRC if you are considering fitting these to a current model Polo GTI. The current (AW) Polo GTI / GTI+ is heavier than the previous generation (6c / 6r) Polo GTI, so the previous generation Polo’s wheels might not be suitable for use on the current GTI / GTI+, even if the bolt pattern (PCD), and offset (ET) mean they will actually fit without any rubbing or clearance issues.

I have VW Motorsport alloys on my previous generation Polo GTI and these wheels have an axle load limit of 960kg. The axle load of the current GTI / GTI+ is 980kg front / 850kg rear. This means my wheels couldn’t safely be used on the current Polo GTI / GTI+ as the front axle load is 20kg greater than the load that the wheels are designed to support. Exceeding the load limit of the wheels would put extra strain on them, and may cause them to buckle or crack. Also, in the UK, if your car’s axle load is greater than the load capabilities of the wheels, your insurance could be invalidated.
BlackBetty
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Re: GTI and WRC rims

Post by BlackBetty »

monkeyhanger wrote: Tue Jan 15, 2019 8:25 pm If you fit those tyres, you're effectively lowering the gearing by 5%
Not really. It's a bit of a calculation but in reality I would be changing the rolling circumference by 2% only (167,17 cm vs 170,56 cm).

Circumference is 2 x Pi x radius
Radius is the diameter of the rim (18 inch or 45,72 cm) plus the height of the tire. With 215/35 that would be 7,52 cm and with 215/40 that would be 8,6cm.

Reason why I asked about 35 is simply because those (new) tires are now fitted to the rims I bought.
BlackBetty
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Re: GTI and WRC rims

Post by BlackBetty »

SRGTD wrote: Tue Jan 15, 2019 9:48 pm It’d be worth checking the load rating of the WRC wheels that were fitted to the previous generation Polo WRC if you are considering fitting these to a current model Polo GTI. The current (AW) Polo GTI / GTI+ is heavier than the previous generation (6c / 6r) Polo GTI, so the previous generation Polo’s wheels might not be suitable for use on the current GTI / GTI+, even if the bolt pattern (PCD), and offset (ET) mean they will actually fit without any rubbing or clearance issues.

I have VW Motorsport alloys on my previous generation Polo GTI and these wheels have an axle load limit of 960kg. The axle load of the current GTI / GTI+ is 980kg front / 850kg rear. This means my wheels couldn’t safely be used on the current Polo GTI / GTI+ as the front axle load is 20kg greater than the load that the wheels are designed to support. Exceeding the load limit of the wheels would put extra strain on them, and may cause them to buckle or crack. Also, in the UK, if your car’s axle load is greater than the load capabilities of the wheels, your insurance could be invalidated.
That's very good advice thank you. Where can I check the load rating of those wheels?
SRGTD
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Re: GTI and WRC rims

Post by SRGTD »

BlackBetty wrote: Wed Jan 16, 2019 7:34 pm
SRGTD wrote: Tue Jan 15, 2019 9:48 pm It’d be worth checking the load rating of the WRC wheels that were fitted to the previous generation Polo WRC if you are considering fitting these to a current model Polo GTI. The current (AW) Polo GTI / GTI+ is heavier than the previous generation (6c / 6r) Polo GTI, so the previous generation Polo’s wheels might not be suitable for use on the current GTI / GTI+, even if the bolt pattern (PCD), and offset (ET) mean they will actually fit without any rubbing or clearance issues.

I have VW Motorsport alloys on my previous generation Polo GTI and these wheels have an axle load limit of 960kg. The axle load of the current GTI / GTI+ is 980kg front / 850kg rear. This means my wheels couldn’t safely be used on the current Polo GTI / GTI+ as the front axle load is 20kg greater than the load that the wheels are designed to support. Exceeding the load limit of the wheels would put extra strain on them, and may cause them to buckle or crack. Also, in the UK, if your car’s axle load is greater than the load capabilities of the wheels, your insurance could be invalidated.
That's very good advice thank you. Where can I check the load rating of those wheels?
Most of the wheel spec information is stamped into the reverse side of the wheel spokes, but I don’t think the load rating information is.

I found out the load rating of my VW Motorsport wheels on a VW retailer’s website that were selling them - I was planning on keeping these wheels to use on my next car (which will be a current model Polo GTI+ in around 18 months time), but will now be selling them as I don’t want to run a set of wheels with too low a load rating for the car.

I’d try your VW dealer to see if they can establish the load rating of the WRC wheels, if they can’t, I’d contact the manufacturer of the wheels for the information. VW use a number of manufacturers for their wheels - such as Ronal, Borbet, BBS. The manufacturers name is usually stamped into the reverse of one of the wheel spokes. Alternatively, if you know the VW part number for the wheels (it should be on of the pieces of information on the reverse side of the wheel spokes), you may be able to find the load rating information by searching on the internet.
BlackBetty
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Re: GTI and WRC rims

Post by BlackBetty »

SRGTD wrote: Wed Jan 16, 2019 8:16 pm
BlackBetty wrote: Wed Jan 16, 2019 7:34 pm
SRGTD wrote: Tue Jan 15, 2019 9:48 pm It’d be worth checking the load rating of the WRC wheels that were fitted to the previous generation Polo WRC if you are considering fitting these to a current model Polo GTI. The current (AW) Polo GTI / GTI+ is heavier than the previous generation (6c / 6r) Polo GTI, so the previous generation Polo’s wheels might not be suitable for use on the current GTI / GTI+, even if the bolt pattern (PCD), and offset (ET) mean they will actually fit without any rubbing or clearance issues.

I have VW Motorsport alloys on my previous generation Polo GTI and these wheels have an axle load limit of 960kg. The axle load of the current GTI / GTI+ is 980kg front / 850kg rear. This means my wheels couldn’t safely be used on the current Polo GTI / GTI+ as the front axle load is 20kg greater than the load that the wheels are designed to support. Exceeding the load limit of the wheels would put extra strain on them, and may cause them to buckle or crack. Also, in the UK, if your car’s axle load is greater than the load capabilities of the wheels, your insurance could be invalidated.
That's very good advice thank you. Where can I check the load rating of those wheels?
Most of the wheel spec information is stamped into the reverse side of the wheel spokes, but I don’t think the load rating information is.

I found out the load rating of my VW Motorsport wheels on a VW retailer’s website that were selling them - I was planning on keeping these wheels to use on my next car (which will be a current model Polo GTI+ in around 18 months time), but will now be selling them as I don’t want to run a set of wheels with too low a load rating for the car.

I’d try your VW dealer to see if they can establish the load rating of the WRC wheels, if they can’t, I’d contact the manufacturer of the wheels for the information. VW use a number of manufacturers for their wheels - such as Ronal, Borbet, BBS. The manufacturers name is usually stamped into the reverse of one of the wheel spokes. Alternatively, if you know the VW part number for the wheels (it should be on of the pieces of information on the reverse side of the wheel spokes), you may be able to find the load rating information by searching on the internet.
Thank you again. VW part number is 6R0601025BA and they are made by Ronal. Did already some web search but without success so far.
monkeyhanger
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Re: GTI and WRC rims

Post by monkeyhanger »

BlackBetty wrote: Wed Jan 16, 2019 7:33 pm
monkeyhanger wrote: Tue Jan 15, 2019 8:25 pm If you fit those tyres, you're effectively lowering the gearing by 5%
Not really. It's a bit of a calculation but in reality I would be changing the rolling circumference by 2% only (167,17 cm vs 170,56 cm).

Circumference is 2 x Pi x radius
Radius is the diameter of the rim (18 inch or 45,72 cm) plus the height of the tire. With 215/35 that would be 7,52 cm and with 215/40 that would be 8,6cm.

Reason why I asked about 35 is simply because those (new) tires are now fitted to the rims I bought.
We're actually both wrong. Did the 5% in my head, quite aware of the maths to get there. 215/40 R18 has a 3.5% bigger diameter (and therefore 3.5% bigger circumference - you don't need to involve pi as a constant, just work out the diameter of the wheel with tyre).

25.4mm to an inch. 25.4 x 18 = 457.2mm for wheel.

Add 2 x tyre wall height

215 x 0.4 x 2 = 172.0mm for 215/40.

or

215 × 0.35 × 2 = 150.5mm for 215/35

Total dia 215/40 = 457.2mm + 172.0mm = 629.2mm

Total dia 215/35 = 457.2mm x 150.5mm = 607.7mm

((629.2mm/607.7mm) x 100 ) -100 = 3.5%

Seeing as the difference in diameter between a new tyre and a worn tyre (down to 2mm from 8mm) is just over half of that difference, I wouldn't worry too much about it.
BlackBetty
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Re: GTI and WRC rims

Post by BlackBetty »

monkeyhanger wrote: Wed Jan 16, 2019 9:15 pm
BlackBetty wrote: Wed Jan 16, 2019 7:33 pm
monkeyhanger wrote: Tue Jan 15, 2019 8:25 pm If you fit those tyres, you're effectively lowering the gearing by 5%
Not really. It's a bit of a calculation but in reality I would be changing the rolling circumference by 2% only (167,17 cm vs 170,56 cm).

Circumference is 2 x Pi x radius
Radius is the diameter of the rim (18 inch or 45,72 cm) plus the height of the tire. With 215/35 that would be 7,52 cm and with 215/40 that would be 8,6cm.

Reason why I asked about 35 is simply because those (new) tires are now fitted to the rims I bought.
We're actually both wrong. Did the 5% in my head, quite aware of the maths to get there. 215/40 R18 has a 3.5% bigger diameter (and therefore 3.5% bigger circumference - you don't need to involve pi as a constant, just work out the diameter of the wheel with tyre).

25.4mm to an inch. 25.4 x 18 = 457.2mm for wheel.

Add 2 x tyre wall height

215 x 0.4 x 2 = 172.0mm for 215/40.

or

215 × 0.35 × 2 = 150.5mm for 215/35

Total dia 215/40 = 457.2mm + 172.0mm = 629.2mm

Total dia 215/35 = 457.2mm x 150.5mm = 607.7mm

((629.2mm/607.7mm) x 100 ) -100 = 3.5%

Seeing as the difference in diameter between a new tyre and a worn tyre (down to 2mm from 8mm) is just over half of that difference, I wouldn't worry too much about it.
You are perfectly right. I took only once the tire height but of course you have to add it twice to the rim diameter. Hence you end up with a correct 3,5% difference. I'm more worried about the looks (gap) than the impact on speedometer readout to be honest...
monkeyhanger
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Re: GTI and WRC rims

Post by monkeyhanger »

I'd go with the bigger tyre - the arch gaps are far too big on the GTI akready. Not sure if that's the price you pay for having adjustible suspension (a basic version of DCC). My Golf R sits way lowwrthan my Polo GTI+. Never compared my R with a DCC equipped R to judge a difference.

If I can assure myself that the seemingly tiny clearance between inner tyre edge and wheel arch lining on the rear drivers side wheel where the fuel filler tube goes would accommodate a 225/40 R18 tyre (much more common than 215/40 R18, and hence much cheaper) I'd be going for the 225/40 (8mm bigger diameter over 215/40). Might need some very narrow spacers on the back wheels to accommodate if the gap is too. small to the aforementioned arch lining to accommodate an extra 5mm protrusion at the back wheel face + potentially a fatter tyre lip.

Spacers would probably pay for themselves on first tyre change seeing as Michelin Pilot Sport 4 are £40 a piece cheaper in 225/40 R18 than 215/40 R18.
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