Front discs and pads

[RUM4MO]

An aftermarket company called BigRed can't say if that is the correct spelling, do sell kits I think by mail order.

It was only in recent years that I've lub'd the guide pins and with silicon grease as copper grease will cause the rubber damper bushes to swell in time.

Prior to that I'd only ever use a green pad to scrub the guide pins then spray them with brake cleaner etc and repeated until they were looking clean.

Edit:- http://biggred.co.uk/

[JohnMcClaane]

I was very lucky and just managed to be in time for eurocarparts weekend 37% off sale.
Bought all 4 discs, ventilated - Bosch and all pads also from Bosch, with a spray can of copper grease for £156.
Bank holiday Monday next week will be Brake Holiday Monday for me

[hartge]

tempted to get a full set all around for my 1.9 tdi, comes to 117 for brakes, pads (bremos) and fluid from ECP/CP4L

[littlepolo]

The front nearside squeak has returned so I've ordered a Brake Caliper Repair Kit from Big Red.

The front calipers are stamped FS-III which I've learned is ATE (Alfred Teves) of Germany. Fortunately, the kit is the cheapest of the three options (the others being Lucas and BEN) at £13.95 for both sides. The part no is BRK205214.

Hope the mild weather continues and I can find sufficient motivation.

[RUM4MO]

Wait a minute, I've always considered that FS111 was a "Lucas" calliper, the ATE (Teves) calliper was only used on the cars with the 288mm discs and the calliper+calliper carrier+mounting bracket+hub, what you will have is a calliper+calliper carrier/mounting+hub.

Now, I could be wrong there, but I don't think so - your car will have the 256mm front discs.

[RUM4MO]

Hum, I might have tried confusing you and myself there as I posted back 2014 that I thought that they were Girling but had discovered elsewhere that they might be ATE!!!!!

Still undecided!

[littlepolo]

I could not figure it out either so I sent some photos of the caliper to Big Red and they said I need the ATE kit.

I'll soon find out if they fit or not...

[RUM4MO]

It is a bit annoying when you can't find out for sure, I do know that the front callipers on my old Passat were ATE, and the same callipers on my wife's new Polo are ATE, and the rear callipers with the handbrake built in on both these cars I mentioned are Lucas - though now TRW as Lucas has gone, but not good info on the FS111 callipers!!

[littlepolo]

Well, the seal kit did fit so they must be ATE calipers.

When I removed the wheel I found some scoring and wear on the discs indicating that the f n/s brake had been binding. On disassembly there was still some grease on the slide pins (unlike last time). Popped the piston out and found longitudinal scoring on the underside and fine particles in the fluid - possibly from a deteriorating hose? I don't think the fluid was ever flushed as per schedule but doubt that would have cleared the bore of debris.

Anyway, it looks like debris got into the cylinder and might have caused friction when the brakes warmed up and expanded. Removed the caliper to the bench to clean it up and refit the piston with the new seal. It was a fiddle at first but found a way to do it after a while. Fit seal over piston and slide down to near bottom so that the seal is opened out. Let the caliper seal end hang over the edge of the piston holding the piston with the piston seal end and then drop the caliper seal end into the caliper, keeping it central, then drop the piston into the bore pushing down the seal into the groove.

I expect the problem might recur at some point because it was not really a problem with the seal but debris in the bore and scoring on the piston itself. Perhaps a coincidence it occurred when I fitted the new front discs and pads earlier this year.

Edit: A quick inspection of the rear brakes indicates pads down to about 3mm. I'm hoping they'll last the winter. Big Red have a service kit for the rear calipers which they say should overcome the problem of being unable to rewind the piston to change the pads. I imagine that will require benchwork to get the old pistons out and replace with new parts.

[bvs]

Sounds like good progress LP

[RUM4MO]

I'm just resurrecting this thread as I might have something to add to what has been said already.

Okay it concerns a much newer Polo, a 2015 VW Polo 1.2TSI 110PS, so that means ATE FN3 front callipers with 54mm pistons and Lucas/TRW rear callipers with 38mm pistons, at around the 48,000 miles and 8.5 years old, the rear RHS brake calliper started to seize and warmed the pads up quite a bit. I initially hoped it was just seized rear pads as it was 18 months since I last "serviced" the brakes - and by the car's 6 or 8 year point I had always meant to drop the "every 2 years" brake servicing down to "every year" - but somehow ignored my own words! Unfortunately it was due to seized pads although the "getting hot" had caused them to seize - it was a seized rear calliper piston. So I just grabbed a re-manufactured by/for Pagid, Lucas/TRW rear RHS calliper from Halfords(much cheaper than from ECP - but Halfords orders them in from ECP, and you don't need to hand back the old calliper!
So, that gave me the chance to investigate what/why this calliper had started to seize - and I discovered that it is just as discussed elsewhere, it is, for the aluminium rear callipers, the aluminium oxides/salts sticking to the upper end of the now extended piston and stopping it getting dragged back slightly when the handbrake is off or the fluid pressure has dropped, also, more aluminium oxide/salts start to get under the piston's "score seal" and that also grips the piston more than normal. I could probably have got way with fitting a new score seal and new dust cover, after polishing the piston clean, I'll probably do this to the still okay LHS rear calliper once I've perfected the "piston seals fitting and piston refitting" - as, for some reason, I had already had a new set of seals and dust covers in a TRW service kit I bought some time before!

The issue, as outlined by others, for the front ATE iron callipers seems to be that the same road water/moisture gets in under the dust seal and attacks the spring steel retainer ring for the dust cover - this might be what has caused the longitudinal scores that you @littlepolo found on a front calliper piston. I've now ordered up from Bigg Red, a set of front calliper seals and dust caps, and prepare to at least check>clean up>replace the dust covers and retainer spring clips.
Edit:- sorry I should have made things clearer, the dust cover retainer ring rusts up and breaks up, and this shows up more as the pads wear down and the dust cover gets extended and so pulls up free from the calliper body, so things get worse quicker.

Prior to this, I have only ever had a single rear Lucas calliper seize on a VW Group car, and that was a 2000 VW Passat 4Motion, again at maybe 8.5 years and 60,000miles. My mate was sorting out his son's 2012 Audi A3 1.6 with over 85,000 miles and it had both rear callipers seized - well he could not retract the pistons, first time that he had worked on these Lucas rear callipers, and didn't have much time to complete sorting its rear brakes out, so he can not comment exactly on the minimum work that he would have needed to do to free up these callipers.

Just some comments really just in case someone has this job heading their way. I guess that I was lucky when my wife ran a 2002 VW Polo 1.4 16V for 13 years and 105,000 miles - maybe replacing the rear pads early worked in my savour as although I seem to remember that both rear callipers were tricky to retract, I did get them fully back in, and probably did that to them and the front callipers every 2 years after it was 6 years old, so by doing that, I was effectively scrubbing/clearing the pistons of accumulated junk - and that kept them working for 13+ years!