found another NZ !

Krupa · Post by **Krupa** » Sat Jul 17, 2004 1:50 am

I'm not debating that it's probably quicker than a CL as it is, or even that it has around 75bhp same as a GT, I just don't buy all of this "testbed" stuff. As I said in my previous post, what's the point in doing a test multipoint injected CL with the same power as a GT? Doesn't make any sense to me. Especially the whole making it a CL for insurance sake thing, why would VW be releasing a car with GT power and a CL chassis to fool insurance companies?

Some CLs have multipoint injection, and as I said earlier that's probably because they're spare 75bhp Mk2 GT engines left over after the end of their run. Same as that Ibiza with the 3F (GT) engine, which is probably just registered as a 1.3 Ibiza. Good news for the owners I'm sure, and it does make their cars unusual, but I just don't believe this "testbed" stuff.

Gareth_GT_Hatch · Post by **Gareth_GT_Hatch** » Sat Jul 17, 2004 10:42 am

Tahrey1043 wrote:
Gareth_GT_Hatch wrote:I agree, you having the AHZ will be alot better than the AHD box outta mine. Make sure its definately an AHZ tho becuase theres another 1 litre one that has the same 5th as the 4th on ur box now, whereas the AHZ has a marginally longer 5th.
That'll possibly be yer evil AFA thing you're thinking of, either that or the AHZ itself (5th = 4th on 8P? thats the one you meant with the 4th?).. the AHD has the longer ratio (by dint of different final on same internals). I think.

Could be wrong, just reading the numbers up off the chart (which mostly came from ETKA... and therefore probably as falliable as the average dealership mechanic! )

Just talkin about the different 1043 5-speed boxes, nowt do wit 8p or AHD.

Tahrey1043 · Post by **Tahrey1043** » Sat Jul 17, 2004 12:53 pm

concept-e wrote:PAUL:
i can officially say that my CL/GT/unknown car car pull over 100 at about 4.7K on the dials and was still going strong but i ran out of clear motorway!

"Runway" you mean

hehe

It's almost certainly 75hp then or something considerably over "55"... at that engine speed a 55 would only be sticking out similar power to a decat/induction/chip 1-litre at peak

(say, 52hp...

and therefore good for only double figures, unless you were headed downhill... wheras you could expect a 75 to be putting out more like 62-63 (if the curve is anything like a mk3 gt) which is easily low 100s with enough reserve to just keep pulling slowly.
Try it again in 4th rather than 5th and you'll see it rocket past the ton I'm wagering - again assuming the mk2/mk3 GT engines are similar, you'll be revving just a little bit short of peak power at 100mph..

Gareth GT Hatch wrote: Just talkin about the different 1043 5-speed boxes, nowt do wit 8p or AHD.

So, you're basically looking - once again assuming my numbers are right - for the same box layout with a shorter final drive... same sort of (rev) change up points but just a little more oomph all round?
Just trying to figure out which box you're on about where the 4th is the same as 5th on the one you dont want

concept-e · Post by **concept-e** » Sat Jul 17, 2004 5:32 pm

ok the ecu code is
ECU 030 906 021J
DIGIJET

and its MPI

jimmadee · Post by **jimmadee** » Sun Jul 18, 2004 12:11 am

Hello Folks,

Thought I should register at last.

I have a K reg MKIII genesis with an NZ lump, running k coded digijet ecu.

Sounds similar to the other chap - mine 'could' pull to 105mph, 70mph at 3100 rpm.

Speaking to a guy at the 'garage' he reckoned about 65-75bhp as standard. I have followed a GT off the lights and I would say he was about a second and a half ahead at 60mph. Of course you notice the lack of anti-roll bar round fast corners, as the Genesis is based on the Fox,CL line.

I think a fair few early (93) 1.3 Genesis had NZ lumps, I have heard the rumour that they started production on 'left overs' until their production line was upto speed, like factory training models!.

DanW · Post by **DanW** » Sun Jul 18, 2004 1:12 am

jimmadee wrote: Speaking to a guy at the 'garage' he reckoned about 65-75bhp as standard.

I really don't reckon the NZ is quite that power stil tbh.

I have followed a GT off the lights and I would say he was about a second and a half ahead at 60mph. Of course you notice the lack of anti-roll bar round fast corners, as the Genesis is based on the Fox,CL line.

Which would mean you've got a bit less bhp, probably around 60bhp as a guess then? (I'm tired I'm just playin)

I think a fair few early (93) 1.3 Genesis had NZ lumps, I have heard the rumour that they started production on 'left overs' until their production line was upto speed, like factory training models!.

Yeah I've heard this too.

So really there left over MK2 CoupÃ© S engine's (UK models) with CATs on them, hence why I bet every single NZ has the "catalyst" badge on it, as I thought they were tuned down GT engine's because VW didn't have enough space to put the break servos.

Oh and welcome Jimma

[/quote]

Tahrey1043 · Post by **Tahrey1043** » Sun Jul 18, 2004 6:16 am

Hmmm, there's a feature to look for in my next car then..... not just a genesis, but one with a Catalyst badge... just that little bit extra poke and MPi to boot

Gareth_GT_Hatch · Post by **Gareth_GT_Hatch** » Sun Jul 18, 2004 12:41 pm

Tahrey1043 wrote:
concept-e wrote:PAUL:
i can officially say that my CL/GT/unknown car car pull over 100 at about 4.7K on the dials and was still going strong but i ran out of clear motorway!
"Runway" you mean hehe

It's almost certainly 75hp then or something considerably over "55"... at that engine speed a 55 would only be sticking out similar power to a decat/induction/chip 1-litre at peak (say, 52hp... and therefore good for only double figures, unless you were headed downhill... wheras you could expect a 75 to be putting out more like 62-63 (if the curve is anything like a mk3 gt) which is easily low 100s with enough reserve to just keep pulling slowly.
Try it again in 4th rather than 5th and you'll see it rocket past the ton I'm wagering - again assuming the mk2/mk3 GT engines are similar, you'll be revving just a little bit short of peak power at 100mph..

Gareth GT Hatch wrote: Just talkin about the different 1043 5-speed boxes, nowt do wit 8p or AHD.
So, you're basically looking - once again assuming my numbers are right - for the same box layout with a shorter final drive... same sort of (rev) change up points but just a little more oomph all round?
Just trying to figure out which box you're on about where the 4th is the same as 5th on the one you dont want

Dude, Im not looking at anything for me, this is for someone else. Like the man form del monte, he say "yes" and thats it.

poloace · Post by **poloace** » Tue Jul 20, 2004 6:21 am

I've been out in jimmadees NZ and that feels pretty quick faster than my old 55bhp Coupe S. Some NZ were fitted to very late MK2 in the UK as there are MK2 with cats out there! The NZ will have much higher torque than the spi. I will be doing a chip for Pauls NZ and I will compare its stock map to a different NZ ecu chip I have a see if the fueling curves is higher this would help idnetify if it is a a higher power base model. A mpi is always going to be quicker than a spi.

DanW · Post by **DanW** » Wed Jul 21, 2004 12:01 am

poloace wrote:I've been out in jimmadees NZ and that feels pretty quick faster than my old 55bhp Coupe S. Some NZ were fitted to very late MK2 in the UK as there are MK2 with cats out there! The NZ will have much higher torque than the spi. I will be doing a chip for Pauls NZ and I will compare its stock map to a different NZ ecu chip I have a see if the fueling curves is higher this would help idnetify if it is a a higher power base model. A mpi is always going to be quicker than a spi.

steve I thought ur MK2 coupÃ© (which I misstook for a MK1

) had an NZ engine in it?

Tahrey1043 · Post by **Tahrey1043** » Wed Jul 21, 2004 5:13 am

Gareth_GT_Hatch wrote:
Dude, Im not looking at anything for me, this is for someone else. Like the man form del monte, he say "yes" and thats it.

now im reet lost, i dont know which bit of my post you're referring to....

anyways from a meet and a chat with les frÃ©res concept, i'm prepared to believe the NZ has a good bit of pokey there, even if it's because that one's been tuned... (and the 130hp claim is sort-of trustworthy - the previous owner took the necessary mods for that off as the head gasket went (and warped the head a little) and they didn't want to knacker it further.... three things to consider on it, 1. 100hp per litre isn't so uncommon these days, even with non-turbo, so long as you tune the hell out of it with some skill... 2. if the g40 block and head can cope with 115hp plus slightly greater than usual compression (once the charger vs lower base compression is considered) its conceivable that the NZ might be able to - same dimensions and type of metal after all... 3. dont necessarily need a charger to get such performance - think hotrod

major cam, extra and large carbs (or in this case, altered injector timings - ie chipping), advanced ignition, big intakes and low friction exhaust.... etc!)

in the end the only thing to do if you want to settle the argument is organise a rolling road day and see EXACTLY what these things stick out!

Karl_CLCoupe · Post by **Karl_CLCoupe** » Wed Jul 21, 2004 11:45 am

Tahrey1043 wrote:Hmmm, there's a feature to look for in my next car then..... not just a genesis, but one with a Catalyst badge... just that little bit extra poke and MPi to boot

Mind you I only thought the Genesis was only available as a 1 Litre (due to its close Fox relations?). All the same its a nice bonus to have an NZ lump at no extra cost.

Karl.

Tahrey1043 · Post by **Tahrey1043** » Wed Jul 21, 2004 2:38 pm

Odd you say that - until yesterday i'd only ever seen Genesis polos as 1.3's, until i spotted my first 1.0....

concept-e · Post by **concept-e** » Wed Jul 21, 2004 11:15 pm

Steve here now!

I'd have to agree, we should do a rolling road day, perhaps Daan Saaaf tho because you Polo modder's are all t'up North! Id like to know what my GT is at, and how it compares to my bro's NZ. Poloace is (hopefully if he could be so kind!) doing a chip for mine too. Me and my bro will probably take both cars to see him, so he can compare the two and see any similarities between the two engines.

Going in my car and then my brother's id really have to admit there feels like absolutely no difference, except mine is sitting 70mm lower! His is just as quick, imo. We will soon see!

Paul/Steve

Tahrey1043 · Post by **Tahrey1043** » Thu Jul 22, 2004 12:29 am

And being lower is supposed to make you feel like you're going faster, too!

(hence how a go-kart at 30mph will feel like you're on the motorway, but a scooter that puts your head level with a land rover's window feels like you're hardly moving at that speed..)

i didn't know all the polo modders were norvun taipes, i thought it was all saafen

(as regards the paul/steve potential confusion, why not just open up a second account?

)