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typing work all finished, BRING IT ON

(oh yeah, theres the little matter of work at 9 on saturday, pub similar sunday, and taking nan to a little cousin's 1st birthday as well...... sure there'll be plenty of time in between though. None of those require much mental effort on my behalf after all )

edit: great, now it's raining AGAIN. Time to emigrate to, like, arizona or something.

Sorry to have to be a pain and go asking all kinds of uncomfortable questions here again, but i think i'll let my Handy Highlighted Haynes™ do the talking. That and the captions. Some of the instructions here are giving me TEH FEAR again and I want to know if they're neccessary or can be happily ignored, before I go much further...



* Four spanners. Whoops.
* Need to remove oil pump, or can it be left?
* What's a Ridge Reamer? Get away with a regular file or wallpaper / ice-scraper?
* The whole feeler-blade thing is a recurring theme here. Needless to say I have no feeler blades, plastigage, vernier calipers, micrometers, or any of that bumf which i thought was safe to leave far behind in the school D&T workshop Halfords is but five minutes away however if i need to scare some up, but it's getting ever more expensive... so if it's not an absolute requirement..
* What's the deal with the gudgeon pin circlips? Can this mysterious item be left in place, or is it an essential step because e.g. it holds the piston to the crankshaft? (from the look of the instructions i'd say NO it doesnt, but hey.. newbie!)




* Micrometers, verniers, feelers and gudgeons again.......
* Groovycarrot, is that the shape of your "not quite right" piston crown? If so it way still be ok as it looks like the valves will fit in right, etc.




* Good gravy!
* Clearance checking........ again with the feelers.
* Putting the crank case on its side and wedging the piston ring into it might prove tricky to say the least. Seeing as it's still mounted to the subframe 'n all. Plus the whole sticking-the-ring-in-the-bore thing sounds like a pain in the butt, but probably more neccessary and far easier than the other things i'm worrying about. (And again with the feelers - i'm getting the feeling i can't avoid buying some now)
* Don't have a vice either ..... how screwed am I eh
* Big end check - well, i'm not farting about changing any of that stuff, so presumably it should have the same clearance once I'm done as it is now? Never mind having the correct equipment, I'm having trouble visualising how this one is performed - possibly due to not having seen how it all fits together yet, but hey..
* Can you even still buy plastigage? I've never seen a real one.




* I'm almost completely ok with this one, but are there any hidden bogeymen waiting to jump up and claim me?
* Running in will be........ hrm.... fun...... not exceeding about 1/2 to 2/3 max engine speed (3300 to 4000rpm) or 2/3 to 3/4 throttle will make for a heady mix. Max speed around 55 - 65mph and acceleration measured in fractions of a milk float... (mind you that's probably how the car is SUPPOSED to be driven, most of the time, rather than it being the exception!)
* Assuming I get that far.
* Guess I should grab the tax disc and go get it refunded down the post office? It'll only be about £20 back but it'll pay for the toolage.. then slap 6 months on it once overhaul done with.

Cheers to the maximum,
Tahrey/MSP

Yeah, that's the same shape as my pistons.. don't know what that strange straight edge on your pistons is all about
Btw, I still can't find that fourth piston, I honestly don't have a clue where it's got to.. any luck getting hold of piston rings elsewhere? I would send you the rings from mine but for two problems, you'd still need a piston's worth of rings, and they're very, very brittle so I'd probably snap the oil scraper rings if I tried to remove them.. certainly all but one of my old oil scrapers snapped off, despite trying to remove them carefully.

The gudgeon pin you can ignore, that's if you want to seperate the piston from the con rod which you don't terribly need to do. Do check the end gaps of the piston rings in the bores, they should be fine but just in case.
You will need to remove the oil pump pickup / strainer tube, which is three easy to reach bolts, but you can work around the pump itself but turning the engine slightly off TDC when you try to remove the big end shell from #4 piston.
Can't advise on the ridge reamer.. with luck your bores won't be worn to the point where you'd need one anyway, if they are I'd say you need more than a new set of rings..
A set of feeler guages costs about £3 and is a very useful thing to have. Auto accessory shops, tool shops, garages, anywhere will stock them. Most of the other measurements with micrometers and verniers etc only really apply if you're willing to replace entire pistons, get the block rebored etc.. any problem on that scale wouldn't really be worth it, so don't worry too much about that lot.
If you're not planning on touching the big ends, don't worry about the clearances.. do change the bearings if they look worn though, they don't cost much and they're easy to do. Just make sure GSF don't try to sell you over sized bearings
Use the running in period to do as much rush hour work as you can and p*** off plenty of irate commuters. Nothing like a bit of maliciousness. Always worth putting a legible sign in the back window saying something along the lines of 'Running in engine, please pass' if you feel slightly more friendly.

GroovyCarrot wrote:don't know what that strange straight edge on your pistons is all about

probably some kind of germanic voodoo....

still can't find that fourth piston, I honestly don't have a clue where it's got to..

what a wierd thing to happen..... has a small relative picked it up as a toy?

any luck getting hold of piston rings elsewhere?

haven't looked, to be honest. I'll have to see if Car Spares or anywhere like that can help. VAGparts?
...hell, i might have to get in contact with a stealers

they're very, very brittle

yeah, so i've recently learned

Do check the end gaps of the piston rings in the bores, they should be fine but just in case. You will need to remove the oil pump pickup / strainer tube, but you can work around the pump. A set of feeler guages costs about £3 and is a very useful thing to have. Auto accessory shops, tool shops, garages, anywhere will stock them.

b*llocks! between making the post and reading this, i caved in to the temptation / fear and went and got some from halfords. after all... unlike the other stuff, i'll more likely than not have a need for them some day. even if it's checking the gaps on plugs. may as well check the tappet clearances while i have them, too.

ten quid. robbing sods. i'll go cruise past a local petrol station and see what they have... seven pounds is, after all, seven pounds, or to put it another way, three pints of good premium lager.

thanks for the other info

other measurements with micrometers and verniers etc only really apply if you're willing to replace entire pistons, get the block rebored etc..

yay!
cuz i didn't even SEE those things in halfords (and i went to the bigger of the local ones, which is enormous - size of a modest Asda)
= probably quite pricey, from somewhere like machine mart

big ends, don't worry about the clearances.. do change the bearings if they look worn though, they don't cost much and they're easy to do

um, ok... is it easy to tell?

Use the running in period to do as much rush hour work as you can and p*** off plenty of irate commuters. Nothing like a bit of maliciousness. Always worth putting a legible sign in the back window saying something along the lines of 'Running in engine, please pass' if you feel slightly more friendly.

well i was thinking along those lines, but more like a trip to me dads and back and some other long distance work (i only have about a week of insurance i can put on it before needing to buy a whole year - bloody endsleigh), get it all in as quick as possible..... on busy A-roads and the like. Even better is that going down to bournemouth involves some cracking hills that even on the motorways have knocked the beast back to little more than 65mph at the best of times. Low 3000s rpm + about 70% throttle x 55lbft or less = not so much bhp (say, 22.5?) = the "how big a queue can i build up?" game, especially on those hills without passing lanes... get it down to 3rd or 2nd to avoid labouring

though i'd probably try a little bit of flack deflection with a big condescending sign and a little "honk if in a hurry" note where i'll pull over to get out of the way at the ... hehe ... "earliest" opportunity. IE the next layby, even if its two or more miles.

thanks for the reply, feel a bit better about it now, though not sure where i'll find the rings from. ebay, wanted section, etc i suppose. Or just whimper at GSF's email door.

better yet the florida everglades-like conditions outside seem to have died down, suns out and the puddles have dried up some, so i might go put a couple of old plastic macs down and get that sump off at last.....

Oh, sugar.

Mmkay. Question that i dont think got answered.

DO i have to remove the downpipe / cat, and the driveshaft?

It looks like i can probably get the sump off around the shaft, and i've got all but two bolts out.......... but... they be two bolts that are hidden behind the ruddy thing
And im thinking my bravado about getting it out past the exhaust once unbolted might have been misplaced.

Heh, nevermind.... it's all good. I really should be worrying instead about how i'm ever going to get the bloody thing back on after nearly going blind (and certainly getting very dirty and very stressed) removing the bolts. Something tells me trying to put them back in AND holding the sump/new gasket up at the same time could spell a trip to the funny farm.

Annoyingly they undid very easily, not much strain at all, it was just the contortions caused trouble, and fitting the bit/extension bar into places it barely had clearance despite being weeny.

....

how heavy IS the block, anyway?

I don't have anything accurate, but I recon the block's around 70kg.. certainly feels like trying to lift a very awkwardly shaped and slightly overweight person..
Getting the sump / gasket on again will be no problem, the sump's featherweight, just screw in a bolt in each corner to hold it loosely in place while you get the rest in.
You will certainly want to at least unbolt the downpipe to get the sump off.. it's possible without removing it completely though. I never tried with the driveshaft in place so can't really comment, it's not hard to unbolt from the gearbox end and just drop out of the way though, don't have to remove it completely.

what a wierd thing to happen..... has a small relative picked it up as a toy?

Damn strong little person if they did.. the pistons were in a box under a pile of assorted engine components, including a complete cylinder head... heavy bit of kit for anyone who's likely to take a piston as a toy It's honestly got me baffled though, I can't think what could have happened to it..

well when you find it, can you send my Astra's V5 and insurance docket along as well? i think all of them must be in the same place, and im going to need em for this police statement...
(seriously, they've.... i dunno.... evaporated or something. not with the car documents. not in the fireproof certificate box. not in any other box. not crammed up me back passage. nowhere.)

what was it you were saying about a 34mm socket for the shafts however?! the shaft itself doesn't look that big!

You only need the 34mm socket to undo the hub nut if you're going to completely remove the shafts. Remove the centre cap from one of your front wheels and you'll see the one I mean, it's hoooge (and horrendously tight ) However, if you just want the shaft out of the way then you can take it off at the gearbox end using a splined socket, just six little bolts.

Yay! I suspected something of the type (haynes is it's usual cryptic self on this, but i went into full lateral translation mode) and had my fingers crossed for it but didn't want to presume.

That makes things a little easier then! Though i'd best ensure i have the pots right where i want them, as i wont be able to move the crank by pushing the car back/forth in gear once the shaft's off ("severe hub and bearing damage will occur!") and it seems a bit stiff moving it by hand, what with the lack of oil and all.

Thanks once again

PS I found all those documents. Turns out some time in the dim past I decided to make me a second car document folder (probably something to do with the double fistful of reciepts i was handed down in lieu of a service history book)..... promptly filing it away in the "safe place" of my self-destructing ikea filing cabinet and of course losing it buried under 101 different college and work things... only to be found when I was looking for one of those instead. Maybe the piston has somehow suffered a similar fate? (get imaginative! )

augh --- ok, i know its uncouth to double-post, but.......

Tell me again how the sump comes off?

I think i've run across a little problem that haynes neglects to mention, and you wouldn't have run across if you had the motor on a bench.

I've undone the driveshaft (pretty easy, ignoring all the WD40 in my eyes from cleaning crap out of the splines), undone the last 2.... no, 3 bolts (one was VERY well hidden!) which were again very easy...... triple checked there were no more hidden anywhere that i could possibly reach.. and started peeling the sump off.

I've got it and the seal peeled enough away from the block at the right hand side for the oil pump to be fully exposed, but it simply won't shift at the left end. Tried for 15 solid minutes to get it off, then gave up because the sun started going down and I was worried about bending it.

It looks and feels for all the world that the thing is held in at the left hand side - by the gearbox / clutch bellhousing.

Mk3 (1990/1991) folks, any who have done something similar, can you tell me if this is true? If I'm going to have to take the gearbox out in order to remove the sump, then this is a whole different ball game (and i may as well go for the NZ block/box option )

Anxiously waiting response...... now, i'm off to Car Spares to ask them if they do rings (no website!) before they shut at 1pm

You did remove the last couple of bolts that are inside the bellhousing didn't you? And you have taken the clutch cover plate off? Can't think of anything left in there that would hold it. Whatever you do don't just keep on pulling if it is stuck, there's almost certainly just a bolt somewhere and you really don't want to bend the lip of the sump or you'll have oil everywhere when you reassemble it

huh?

ok thats a whole extra thing now
*goes off reading about clutch cover plates*

edit: well, that's a big 9.7 on the doh-cter scale cheers! lets go get that baby bathed

re-edit: YAY! now it has no hat and no pants neither

WOOT

ALL PISTONS OUT

RINGS ON ORDER FROM GSF INTERNET SITE

but

the bloody old ones dont look too bad, i think it might be bore scoring instead. nads.

all the same
they look like little bacteriophage style alien spaceships
so

WOOOOO

Tahrey1043 wrote: RINGS ON ORDER FROM GSF INTERNET SITE

What did I tell you? Going to have to order myself a set while they're still available.. but I have barely got enough money to get me through the month as it is, so maybe not right now..
As I said in the club house thread, you won't be able to see any wear on the rings, it's microscopic. It'll be there though, change the rings anyway. Also, if you can beg/borrow/steal a bore honer from someone it may be worth running it down the bores to give a clean surface to bed into, if you're worried about the bores being scored.

Hmm, I'll be off to get some rings from GSF asap, if you've been having problems with availability. I paid £20 for a bore de-glaze and hone from my local machinest, as I didn't have a honing tool available.