UK-POLOS.NET - THE VW Polo Forum

I really like the front bumper of the Fabia vRS...



And the rear's not bad either.

THE only things that put me off buying one are that it's only available in 5-Door and that the seats are white!

Apart from that, I loved every minute driving it.

Oh... And it's MUCH nicer looking than the new Ibiza FR or whatever it's called (the 20vT one).

/end hyjack

I love my Polo because she's beautiful, quick and has everything a guy could ask for!

rooboy wrote:

Nelson_Wilbury wrote: The thing that draws ill feeling is your blinkered, unquestioning and unswerving loyalty towards Skodas

Eh?????

I think you will find that the quality of the plastics in the fabia is generally seen (not just by me) to be higher than the Ibiza although not the polo, and vRS apart, I agree the car looks as bland as both the Polo and Ibiza. I like the look of the Ibiza, but the increase in the price for the same car with a worse spec (Ibiza only at the moment) is not worth the difference in price. (the better quality plastics in the Polo is not enough for me to justify the higher price tag).

I never said that I did not like the Polo or Ibiza, just that IMHO the Polo looks the blandest of the three. True the Fabia is not the prettiest car around, but it is not the ugliest either and is one of the best vfm cars around.
I do not have a blinkered, unquestioning and unswerving loyalty towards Skodas as you put it and I put the original answer (the Skoda badge) as a Joke, so at least read the posts properly and get the facts right next time before you reply with a coherent argument.

Don't take it too much to heart then.....

Anyway back to reality for a minute, if you'll kindly abuse the search function of this forum 80% of your posts mention a) Your skoda (which i can forgive) BUT more importantly b) how it is much better than its VW/SEAT stablemates, which isn't true.

Now, thats not my opinion, that is fact. Only a complete idiot would think because you stick a bodykit and big TDi engine in a Skoda it ultimately makes it a generally better car than its in house stablemates. Lets think about about handling for starters....actually, no, lets not.
In fact the only things the VRS Fabia appears to have going for itself is its pace, towing and motorway cruising abilities. But it certainly aint the hot hatch many people claim.
Now, you say you don't like the restrained styling of the Polo GT? Fair enough. I do though, because at the end of the day its not trying to be something that it can never possibly be.

At the end of the day. Seat, VW and Skoda are all aimed at different types of people in the buying market. Seat are aimed at the younger more enthusiastic driver, VW perhaps the more grown up person (though perhaps not in terms of age ) and Skoda the Cretin Pike......

Sorry!! just kidding Seriously though, I'd say Skoda are more aimed at the older generation and people just generally wanting a bargain, cheap no thrills car. Thats why I think VW letting them have the TDi VRS was such a bad idea, its just created more brand confusion, especially when compared with SEAT.

Now, i'm not saying you've said otherwise to any of the above comments, most of it is just me ranting. So don't take it so much to heart this time

Nelson_Wilbury wrote: Only a complete idiot would think because you stick a bodykit and big TDi engine in a Skoda it ultimately makes it a generally better car than its in house stablemates. Lets think about about handling for starters....actually, no, lets not.
In fact the only things the VRS Fabia appears to have going for itself is its pace, towing and motorway cruising abilities. But it certainly aint the hot hatch many people claim.

Neil...

On my 2 hour unacompanied test drive, I found the following:

The Fabia vRS handles very well, even on stock suspension and rubbish michelin tyres.

It makes very rapid progress. OK, you have to change gear sooner when accelerating, but I'd go so far as to say that it wipes the floor with my GTi while moving. I recon mine has the edge on 0-60, but driving is not about 0-60's... it's about in-gear response and elasticity... The torque in these is awesome as standard and means that driving is effortless; just put your foot down in almost any gear and it pulls.
This is the engine Seat are putting in the new Cupra remember... It really is a fantastic motor, and when tuned, jesus, it's awesome: 180bhp is 180bhp in anyone's money.... And the 320lbft just takes the p***!

Also, it's not just a bodykit that's on there... The brakes are more substancial including rear discs, the suspension is stiffer, it has 16" alloys, a decent exhaust, sporty seats, nice clocks, 6 speed box, xenons (low cost option), air conditioned glove box!!!

Maybe you should book a test drive in a vRS to see what I'm on about.

OK, the dash isn't amazing, but it's not bad in any way. The seats are white, which is stupid, and it only comes as a 5-door.... But these are pretty small things compared to the good points I've mentioned above.

Oh, and it'll do >500 miles to a tank of derv!

Not having a go, but maybe you should lighten up a bit

Josh_PoloGTi wrote:It really is a fantastic motor, and when tuned, jesus, it's awesome: 180bhp is 180bhp in anyone's money.... And the 320lbft just takes the p***!

180bhp! That's a bit conservative, jabba got over 200bhp out of theirs.

Josh_PoloGTi wrote:

Nelson_Wilbury wrote: Only a complete idiot would think because you stick a bodykit and big TDi engine in a Skoda it ultimately makes it a generally better car than its in house stablemates. Lets think about about handling for starters....actually, no, lets not.
In fact the only things the VRS Fabia appears to have going for itself is its pace, towing and motorway cruising abilities. But it certainly aint the hot hatch many people claim.

Neil...

On my 2 hour unacompanied test drive, I found the following:

The Fabia vRS handles very well, even on stock suspension and rubbish michelin tyres.

It makes very rapid progress. OK, you have to change gear sooner when accelerating, but I'd go so far as to say that it wipes the floor with my GTi while moving. I recon mine has the edge on 0-60, but driving is not about 0-60's... it's about in-gear response and elasticity... The torque in these is awesome as standard and means that driving is effortless; just put your foot down in almost any gear and it pulls.
This is the engine Seat are putting in the new Cupra remember... It really is a fantastic motor, and when tuned, jesus, it's awesome: 180bhp is 180bhp in anyone's money.... And the 320lbft just takes the p***!

Also, it's not just a bodykit that's on there... The brakes are more substancial including rear discs, the suspension is stiffer, it has 16" alloys, a decent exhaust, sporty seats, nice clocks, 6 speed box, xenons (low cost option), air conditioned glove box!!!

Maybe you should book a test drive in a vRS to see what I'm on about.

OK, the dash isn't amazing, but it's not bad in any way. The seats are white, which is stupid, and it only comes as a 5-door.... But these are pretty small things compared to the good points I've mentioned above.

Oh, and it'll do >500 miles to a tank of derv!

Not having a go, but maybe you should lighten up a bit

Josh mate,

I'm not doubting the engine capabilities, I know what TDi engines can do (i'm in the right job remember ) and I very nearly bought a VRS myself. Yes its fast, but that wasn't my point, my point was that the car cannot possibly handle like say a 205 GTi (or even the Polo GTi, gawd that was fun!) because there is just too much weight up front. Therefore I can't understand why its marketed as a Hot hatch (Skodas words, not mine).

To put it in one sentance. Rooboys opinion was that the Skoda was better because it looked more aggressive than the SEAT or VW. Mine was that the SEAT and VW do more what they say on the tin, whereas the Skoda doesn't!

...and no I won't lighten up! It's Sunday afternoon and theres nothing on TV!

Not all my posts say how good my skoda is, as it is comparable to the Polo in every way (same platform and bits and bobs as you know) and having not driven the polo that is my only reference hence my using the fabia as the starting point. I would expect the same of you if you joined in the discussions on Briskoda. I could go on about the Polo I did have, but as it was a Mk2 it is not exactly the same when in the new polo forum.

About the Fabia being a Hot hatch to quote the Fabia vRS microsite:
The New Fabia vRS, winner of the Scottish Diesel Car of the Year 2003.
It looks like a hot hatch, it feels like a sports car, but you're in for a surprise when you look under the bonnet - it is a high-performance TDI engine. Hot on the road, cool on the pocket, the Fabia vRS, now with more pulling power

as you can see it only says it looks like a hot hatch, not that it is a hot hatch.
it also says hot on the road, not strictly the truth I admit, but it feels a lot faster than it is, to see what I mean either take one for a test drive or wait for the polo and look at that as even before tuning the 230lbft of torque is te same as a Focus RS (proper hot hatch) and the Porsche Boxter (proper sports car).

Oh and you can get 200bhp with a Jabba map AND their new PSI box (power/soot increaser)(just to clear another post up)

Oh and what do the SEAT. VW do more of then?????
get you from A - B= no
give you more power = no (will be the same engine)
Better equipped = can only speak for the Ibiza when it comes to the engine model but, no (although when looking for my previous car, the previous generation polo with the 100bhp 1.4 engine was £2000 more, smaller, worse equipped and had a much higher insurance rating than the highest spec Fabia with the same engine (and it had two more doors too)(I also know that it was considered a warm hatch by VW as well)
better Vfm = no
cheaper = no
better built = no (same standards which Skoda actually does the best out of in independant tests due to the fact the Skoda are trying to complete their pheonix rise from the ashes)
Better handling = drive one first, but every one has a different opinion and the standard versions are set up different.
same car you see everywhere = no (also with Ibiza as they do not sell in as high a number as the VW)
To put it in one sentance my POV was not that it looks more agressive, but that why pay the best part of £13500 for a three door car, when you can get an extremley comparable car for £11990 with two more doors (i know not everyone wants a 5 door car) and a better spec, but a lot of the time it comes down to the badge (not all).

I do not need to lighten up, I just don't like to be taken out of context as I feel I have been.

rooboy wrote: About the Fabia being a Hot hatch to quote the Fabia vRS microsite:
The New Fabia vRS, winner of the Scottish Diesel Car of the Year 2003.
It looks like a hot hatch, it feels like a sports car, but you're in for a surprise when you look under the bonnet - it is a high-performance TDI engine. Hot on the road, cool on the pocket, the Fabia vRS, now with more pulling power

Fabia microsite: The Fabia vRS is powered by a 1.9 TDI PD engine generating 130 bhp, making it one of the few diesel-powered hot hatches on the market.

Please don't misquote me, I never said the VW or Seat offered anything more. I said they promise less and don't try and be something they're not. Which is the reason a 130tdi Ibiza won't differ from a 115 2.0 engine.

Whether they do anything better? Probably not, but that doesn't mean you need to stick a tacky bumper on the front and market as a Hot hatch.

This I have to take issue with, I think its totally unfair to compare a MK5 Polo 16v to a Fabia 16v, not just on a couple of those points, but nearly all of them!

rooboy wrote: better built = no (same standards which Skoda actually does the best out of in independant tests due to the fact the Skoda are trying to complete their pheonix rise from the ashes)

We've been through this many times before. The reason Skoda do so well in Surveys is because there Customers expect much less of the brand. So when things go wrong they shout about it less. I would too if I was getting VW quality for Skoda money.

The same recently has applied with Ford, customers expect 'A to B' cars and poor aftersales service and they are pleasantly supprised when they get the total opposite. They've enhanced the quality of the service to go with the quality of the new cars. This is where VW fall short, but believe me they are aware of it and theres a serious shake-up within the dealer network at the moment.

So its not to do with better quality mechanicals as you mentioned in one of your posts earlier in the month. 99.9% of shared VW group parts are built in the same factory, ignition coils being one example. Can you even begin to imagine the costs involved making four seperate factories to make parts that are shared?!?!

On another note, people tend to mistake my bluntness for trying to flame arguments. It's not true

Nelson_Wilbury wrote: Fabia microsite: The Fabia vRS is powered by a 1.9 TDI PD engine generating 130 bhp, making it one of the few diesel-powered hot hatches on the market.

This I have to take issue with, I think its totally unfair to compare a MK5 Polo 16v to a Fabia 16v, not just on a couple of those points, but nearly all of them!

rooboy wrote: better built = no (same standards which Skoda actually does the best out of in independant tests due to the fact the Skoda are trying to complete their pheonix rise from the ashes)

We've been through this many times before. The reason Skoda do so well in Surveys is because there Customers expect much less of the brand. So when things go wrong they shout about it less. I would too if I was getting VW quality for Skoda money.

To be fair how many diesel powered 'hot' hataches are there then? I can think of Four, all made by VAG (one Golf, one Fabia, One Ibiza, One Leon) and only the Ibiza is not offered as GTI (or similar) spec. Even though they are Skodas words not mine, I never mentioned they were hot hatches although again drive a car with that engine and you will see what they mean as it feels faster than it is. (personally I agree with the warm hatch description, but as you can get it remapped to 200bhp for a little under £500, that turns it to a genuine hot hatch territory for £12500. As a friend of mine was only .5 seconds behind a passat W8 at santa pod and they both regulary leave me behind when they race I think then the term hot hatch is more than allowed even if the car is not standard)

with the Mk5 comparing, it was only in regards to price and equipment, which in my view was poor for the money at the time, I know the current polo with the same engine rates better but it was not out at the time so I can only use the model out as a comparison.

Every skoda owner I know wants the exact same out of their car as any other car owner, just because the car is cheaper it does not mean anybodies expectations are lower, and I said independant tests, by which I mean where people are not the owners of the car, but either none owners driving and using a de-badged version, or where a cars have been looked at after three years to see how well the car has faired over this time (this was done by Auto express last year and Skoda came top of the VAG hatches although there was not too much in it due to the same build standards, which they chose to exceed to build their reputation)

I never mentioned surveys as I know that customer surveys are fickle due to the amount of people replying, but if more owners of other brands bothered to write in the results may be different.

Also why has this thread turned into a Polo vs Fabia thread as they are technically the same car? (I only mentionrd the badge with a smile )

By the way I thoroughly enjoyed reading the above posts.

A V good read, well-done lads, now I'm just going to go out for a drive........................in my VRS






I think the front bumper is the best bit by the way, more people have commented on my Fabia than when I had the Polo

Des

Bah!

Just to add some facts to the "discussion":

Numbers of new registrations in the month of Fabruary:

MANUFACTURER February % YEAR TO DATE %
2004 % 2003 % CHANGE 2004 % 2003 % CHANGE
SEAT 1,158 1.27 1,061 1.20 9.14 2,835 0.98 3,647 1.33 -22.26
SKODA 854 0.93 1,385 1.57 -38.34 2,943 1.02 3,766 1.37 -21.85
VOLKSWAGEN 6,588 7.20 6,001 6.81 9.78 20,878 7.22 20,052 7.30 4.12

Source = SMMT (sorry for the formatting, can't change the font in here).

Can't really explain Seat's fall. VW position not as bad as we thought and Skoda probably tailing off due to the new Octavia coming next month.

Deek.

So back to the original discussion and without mentioning a certain Czech Republic based car company, I quite like the wiper blades, everything else I have in my car already. (I can live without gas strut bonnets, three flash indicators(although the newer ones have it ) and the blue dials).


(and the wiper blades/arms do not fit on the Fabia as I've tried it)

I noticed that the 150Bhp 1.9TDI Leon was faster than the aftermarket chipped 150Bhp Fabia vRS. Just to lighten things up a bit.