Handbrake

[andyxxx]

Update

VW adjusted the handbrake and it is far better, but my daughter still struggles to hold the car using it on a very very steep hill.
VW says it is acceptable and there is no more adjustment possible (and the cables are all ok)

[Andy Beats]

Update

VW adjusted the handbrake and it is far better, but my daughter still struggles to hold the car using it on a very very steep hill.
VW says it is acceptable and there is no more adjustment possible (and the cables are all ok)

Don't you have hill-hold?
When you have hill-hold, the handbrake need never be used apart from parking.

[MilgeS]

Update

VW adjusted the handbrake and it is far better, but my daughter still struggles to hold the car using it on a very very steep hill.
VW says it is acceptable and there is no more adjustment possible (and the cables are all ok)

Don't you have hill-hold?
When you have hill-hold, the handbrake need never be used apart from parking.

Hill hold is ok for experienced drivers but learners or recently passed might not feel confident to use it and prefer the handbrake which is probably what they are used to when learning or if they have had an older vehicle first. And to be honest, you shouldn't be paying out the money VW ask us to pay for their cars and have duff handbrakes in 2019!!

[Andy Beats]

Hill hold is ok for experienced drivers but learners or recently passed might not feel confident to use it and prefer the handbrake which is probably what they are used to when learning or if they have had an older vehicle first. And to be honest, you shouldn't be paying out the money VW ask us to pay for their cars and have duff handbrakes in 2019!!

Well, to be blunt, they need to learn.
Adapting to new technology is part and parcel of driving.

[MilgeS]

Hill hold is ok for experienced drivers but learners or recently passed might not feel confident to use it and prefer the handbrake which is probably what they are used to when learning or if they have had an older vehicle first. And to be honest, you shouldn't be paying out the money VW ask us to pay for their cars and have duff handbrakes in 2019!!

Well, to be blunt, they need to learn.
Adapting to new technology is part and parcel of driving.

They do learn, both ways, handbrake and hill assist, same as auto light/wipers and the rest of the tech on new cars but the reality is if you are used to using a handbrake then you will want to use a handbrake, let's hope someone that isn't confident on a hill without using a handbrake doesn't try it with you behind them and roll into you, but you'll probably say "don't worry, you need to learn "

[Andy Beats]

They do learn, both ways, handbrake and hill assist, same as auto light/wipers and the rest of the tech on new cars but the reality is if you are used to using a handbrake then you will want to use a handbrake, let's hope someone that isn't confident on a hill without using a handbrake doesn't try it with you behind them and roll into you, but you'll probably say "don't worry, you need to learn "

I've been used to a handbrake for 35 years, I adapted to hill-start in seconds.
No offence, but if anyone can't adapt to hill-start quickly and still insists on using the handbrake.....blimey....

[MilgeS]

They do learn, both ways, handbrake and hill assist, same as auto light/wipers and the rest of the tech on new cars but the reality is if you are used to using a handbrake then you will want to use a handbrake, let's hope someone that isn't confident on a hill without using a handbrake doesn't try it with you behind them and roll into you, but you'll probably say "don't worry, you need to learn "

I've been used to a handbrake for 35 years, I adapted to hill-start in seconds.
No offence, but if anyone can't adapt to hill-start quickly and still insists on using the handbrake.....blimey....

But the whole point of this thread is the defective handbrake on the Polo's, not about hill assist at all. Hill assist won't fail an MOT, a defective handbrake will, and it's an integral part of the car. We can all adapt to using hill assist, it is exactly that, to assist, a handbrake isn't there to assist, it is there for a reason, not an option.

[Andy Beats]

But the whole point of this thread is the defective handbrake on the Polo's, not about hill assist at all. Hill assist won't fail an MOT, a defective handbrake will, and it's an integral part of the car. We can all adapt to using hill assist, it is exactly that, to assist, a handbrake isn't there to assist, it is there for a reason, not an option.

You've said your daughter struggles to get it to hold on a hill, I've presumed because she doesn't have the strength to pull it any further? (god, that sounds dodgy...sorry).
is it just as bad with you?
I'm thinking its effectiveness in an MOT might be separate from the issue your daughter has with it.

[MilgeS]

But the whole point of this thread is the defective handbrake on the Polo's, not about hill assist at all. Hill assist won't fail an MOT, a defective handbrake will, and it's an integral part of the car. We can all adapt to using hill assist, it is exactly that, to assist, a handbrake isn't there to assist, it is there for a reason, not an option.

You've said your daughter struggles to get it to hold on a hill, I've presumed because she doesn't have the strength to pull it any further? (god, that sounds dodgy...sorry).
is it just as bad with you?
I'm thinking its effectiveness in an MOT might be separate from the issue your daughter has with it.

Sorry for any confusion, it's not my thread but I believe that is what the OP was referring to.

I teach learners and some do struggle to apply it enough to hold, and if they do manage to, they struggle to release it, then others near enough pull it out of the floor! They are not confident with it because the car often rolls when they think it's applied.

I always start by teaching them to apply gas, find the bite and then release the handbrake, as they're unlikely to have hill assist on their first cars, then as we progress to use the hill assist. Inevitably they stall more with hill assist as they rush moving off because of the dreaded car behind, thus flicking the clutch too much and not using enough gas to get the car away.

My manual car handbrake is much better now they've lubricated the moving parts, the auto handbrake is still rubbish, when you lift it you start to feel tension, then nothing and then tension at the top, so I'm pushing for replacing the cable after 2 attempts at lubricant have failed to improve it.

I and others don't expect to pay 18+k for a car with a malfunctioning handbrake, not in this day and age!

[andyxxx]

But the whole point of this thread is the defective handbrake on the Polo's, not about hill assist at all. Hill assist won't fail an MOT, a defective handbrake will, and it's an integral part of the car. We can all adapt to using hill assist, it is exactly that, to assist, a handbrake isn't there to assist, it is there for a reason, not an option.

You've said your daughter struggles to get it to hold on a hill, I've presumed because she doesn't have the strength to pull it any further? (god, that sounds dodgy...sorry).
is it just as bad with you?
I'm thinking its effectiveness in an MOT might be separate from the issue your daughter has with it.

Yes - that is correct. I can get it to hold but have far more strength and need to pull it as far as it will go.

[andyxxx]

I have never heard of hill hold/hill assist until these replies. The car may well have it, but that's not the way an instructor teaches a learner to start a car on a hill.

I have now spoken to VW customer care, who are supposed to be calling me back within the next couple of days (but in the first instance more or less said, it's nothing to do with us - take it up with your dealer!!!)
I have emailed and called the dealer and await to speak to them again.

[Andy Beats]

I have never heard of hill hold/hill assist until these replies. The car may well have it, but that's not the way an instructor teaches a learner to start a car on a hill.

Well they need to change as well.
More and more cars are being fitted with hill hold - I can't actually remember the last car I had that didn't have it.
The handbrake, whether it be manual or electronic, doesn't get touched in normal driving and is just a parking brake now.
They ditched hand signals when indicators became the norm, they need to ditch hill starts using irrelevant levers now too.

[Adam_013]

I have never heard of hill hold/hill assist until these replies. The car may well have it, but that's not the way an instructor teaches a learner to start a car on a hill.

Well they need to change as well.
More and more cars are being fitted with hill hold - I can't actually remember the last car I had that didn't have it.
The handbrake, whether it be manual or electronic, doesn't get touched in normal driving and is just a parking brake now.
They ditched hand signals when indicators became the norm, they need to ditch hill starts using irrelevant levers now too.

I agree, but also don't.

Most first cars are around 2003-2009 which certainly don't have hill-assist. Especially since they're not going to be top spec.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

[Andy Beats]

Most first cars are around 2003-2009 which certainly don't have hill-assist. Especially since they're not going to be top spec.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

So what's the solution?
Traditional handbrake levers are dying out, so there will come a time (soon) when the type of car they learn in and the type of car they buy will differ.
Are driving schools going to keep using old cars to match the sort of cars their pupils will buy...?
What happens when the driving school car has a handbrake lever and the pupil says "Ooh the car I'm going to drive doesn't have one of those?"
Surely the only sensible solution is to go with what is becoming the norm, and that is the handbrake is purely for parking now.

[Adam_013]

Most first cars are around 2003-2009 which certainly don't have hill-assist. Especially since they're not going to be top spec.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

So what's the solution?
Traditional handbrake levers are dying out, so there will come a time (soon) when the type of car they learn in and the type of car they buy will differ.
Are driving schools going to keep using old cars to match the sort of cars their pupils will buy...?

Well, very true. But then again, the handbrake should still hold the vehicle on a hill regardless of hill-start assist or not. If one was parked on an incline you wouldn't expect it to roll back.

I'd imagine it'll still be a while until small hatchbacks get e-brakes. Saying that, the golf isn't far off a polo so perhaps it'll be sooner than we think.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk