UK-POLOS.NET - THE VW Polo Forum

Early days yet but as we get older we make very few long journeys. We have a big boys toy car in the garage suitable for long trips so I am in the early stages of potentially swapping the Gti for one of VWs electric cars possibly available later this year or early next. There is the iD , a golf sized car and an iD Crozz which is an electric Tiguan equivalent. The Golf sized one has 180 bhp with one motor but the Crozz has two motors with a total of 300 bhp and 4WD. My dealer says VW are trying to make these cars mass market price wise. Range has been announced( depending on battery pack size) of around 300 miles per charge.
The reason I am examining this subject so early is to see if it is worth getting an order in as soon as the books open to try and avoid the delay of six months I had when buying the Polo. I believe the new cars will not be built in South Africa thus avoiding the 8 week transport delay. I know it is early to be thinking of swapping but at the moment my Gti is the only one my dealer has sold or even had for demo so the part ex/ private sale could be generous.
Most of our journeys are less than 12 miles. We are on economy seven for electricity so overnight charges would be low.
Any comments or suggestions?

If your range needs are so low, why take one on that can do 300 miles?
Longer range = higher cost, it's that simple.
There's no denying higher range EVs are very expensive just now, the 64KwH Konas are going for £40k to avoid the waiting list and the new long range 60KwH Leaf is going to be around £40k as well.
The high cost, for many people, is offset by avoiding tolls and massively reduced fuel bills, but that's not going to apply to you.
If VW truly release 300 mile EVs at sensible money, they will be game changers.
I intend to get back into an EV when they come back into my budget.
I benefited from a great PCP on my Leaf that I couldn't replicate, so I'm back in an ICE temporarily.
There's loads of things I miss about the Leaf, like the cold morning pre-heating and the instant acceleration.

We have one trip from home to the Manchester area to which is about 90 miles each way so the 300 miles range means we could do that trip comfortably on one charge. Anything longer would be diesel based in the Jag.
It all depends really on purchase cost when they are announced. The sensible choice would be the Golf sized one but the four wheel drive 300 bhp could be tempting as we have a steep drive so when it is icy that could help( the 300 bhp is also tempting but a bit naughty!)
Interestingly the golf sized one is rear wheel drive.

barrywi wrote: Thu Feb 21, 2019 2:01 pm We have one trip from home to the Manchester area to which is about 90 miles each way so the 300 miles range means we could do that trip comfortably on one charge. Anything longer would be diesel based in the Jag.
It all depends really on purchase cost when they are announced. The sensible choice would be the Golf sized one but the four wheel drive 300 bhp could be tempting as we have a steep drive so when it is icy that could help( the 300 bhp is also tempting but a bit naughty!)
Interestingly the golf sized one is rear wheel drive.

As you say, it all depends on cost.
There is a temptation for new EV owners to go for the max range they can get, when they really don't need it.
Subsequently paying more for the car than they need to.
An example is people paying for a Leaf 30KwH when the much cheaper 24KwH would do them fine and save them thousands.
Depending on how often you need to make that 90 mile trip, you may be better just hiring an ICE car or taking the train.
Also bear in mind that just because the trip is 90 miles doesn't mean you need 180+ miles range.
Yes, the ability to get there and back on one charge is nice, but rapid charging when you get there (or en-route) is also a consideration.
I'm more than happy to answer any EV questions, I seem to be the only one here with any practical experience.

Despite the relative rarity of the Polo GTI, more are coming through now that GPF WLTP compliance is sorted - no one is going to pay anywhere near full price for what will be a year old one when the ID is available, and it still needs enough margin to sell. If you were lucky enough for a year old Polo GTI+ to command a forecourt price of £20k, most you'll get in p/x is £17k - they want to make 15-20% on it.

If the ID is that good, as an early adopter you're unlikely to get much discount, and early days for a new model you are still looking at a hefty wait.

monkeyhanger wrote: Thu Feb 21, 2019 2:18 pm If the ID is that good, as an early adopter you're unlikely to get much discount

You'll get zero discount, I guarantee it.
They'll do what every other car manufacturer has done, they'll throttle supply and keep prices high.
If they made as many as they could, cheaply, they'd hammer their ICE car demand too much.
They want a progressive change from ICE to EV, they don't want their ICE cars becoming irrelevant overnight.

I suppose you also have to ask how realistic the theoretical 300 mile range being intimated by VW is. Could this be a 150 mile range in real world driving conditions?

Presumably, use of equipment such as air con / heating, lights, infotainment system heated seats etc. could reduce this theoretical range by quite some margin, as would hard acceleration, driving in hilly terrain, driving at motorway speeds as opposed to in town.

There’s no denying that the range of these vehicles is increasing though, compared to what electric cars could achieve a few years ago.

Andy Beats wrote: Thu Feb 21, 2019 2:16 pm

barrywi wrote: Thu Feb 21, 2019 2:01 pm We have one trip from home to the Manchester area to which is about 90 miles each way so the 300 miles range means we could do that trip comfortably on one charge. Anything longer would be diesel based in the Jag.
It all depends really on purchase cost when they are announced. The sensible choice would be the Golf sized one but the four wheel drive 300 bhp could be tempting as we have a steep drive so when it is icy that could help( the 300 bhp is also tempting but a bit naughty!)
Interestingly the golf sized one is rear wheel drive.

As you say, it all depends on cost.
There is a temptation for new EV owners to go for the max range they can get, when they really don't need it.
Subsequently paying more for the car than they need to.
An example is people paying for a Leaf 30KwH when the much cheaper 24KwH would do them fine and save them thousands.
Depending on how often you need to make that 90 mile trip, you may be better just hiring an ICE car or taking the train.
Also bear in mind that just because the trip is 90 miles doesn't mean you need 180+ miles range.
Yes, the ability to get there and back on one charge is nice, but rapid charging when you get there (or en-route) is also a consideration.
I'm more than happy to answer any EV questions, I seem to be the only one here with any practical experience.

Thanks for the feedback and obviously cost is a major factor. From where we live public transport is a definite non starter. We would spend more time getting there and back than we would with our family, and relying on public transport is not something I would enjoy. Hiring a car would be daft for us as we have two cars anyway. Having grown up without a car until I was 21 I am not prepared to go back to those days of uncertainty and reliance on set train/ bus timetables. I love the independance of car ownership and door to door transport.

SRGTD wrote: Thu Feb 21, 2019 2:30 pm I suppose you also have to ask how realistic the theoretical 300 mile range being intimated by VW is. Could this be a 150 mile range in real world driving conditions?

Presumably, use of equipment such as air con / heating, lights, infotainment system heated seats etc. could reduce this theoretical range by quite some margin, as would hard acceleration, driving in hilly terrain, driving at motorway speeds as opposed to in town.

There’s no denying that the range of these vehicles is increasing though, compared to what electric cars could achieve a few years ago.

Fair point and I am being realistic about this situation and like doing my research...hence the original post to test the water.

SRGTD wrote: Thu Feb 21, 2019 2:30 pm I suppose you also have to ask how realistic the theoretical 300 mile range being intimated by VW is. Could this be a 150 mile range in real world driving conditions?

Presumably, use of equipment such as air con / heating, lights, infotainment system heated seats etc. could reduce this theoretical range by quite some margin, as would hard acceleration, driving in hilly terrain, driving at motorway speeds as opposed to in town.

There’s no denying that the range of these vehicles is increasing though, compared to what electric cars could achieve a few years ago.

Yes, like any car, range is affected by these things.
The test criteria for EV range has been tightened up though, it should be much more realistic than it used to be.
To give you an idea, my Leaf used to have a summer range of approx 90 miles.
That would fall to around 60 miles in the winter with all the heating and heated stuff (seats/steering wheel) on.
But even that did me most of a week and I drove it hard, enjoying the acceleration to its full.
I drove the Leaf MUCH harder than I do the Polo, because it was just fun to do so and see people's faces.
I would then charge it at home while I slept (podpoint in the garage), or I'd use the free rapid charges at the local park and ride for 1/2 an hour.

barrywi wrote: Thu Feb 21, 2019 2:32 pm Thanks for the feedback and obviously cost is a major factor. From where we live public transport is a definite non starter. We would spend more time getting there and back than we would with our family, and relying on public transport is not something I would enjoy. Hiring a car would be daft for us as we have two cars anyway. Having grown up without a car until I was 21 I am not prepared to go back to those days of uncertainty and reliance on set train/ bus timetables. I love the independance of car ownership and door to door transport.

I'm not sure what battery/range options VW intend to offer.
But if there's a lower capacity model, maybe look at that.
If you want to do 90 miles at motorway speeds, a model with 150 miles range would do you fine (obviously with a re-charge at destination or en-route).
There might be a marked difference in price between the different range models, as there is with the Kona.
Have you driven an electric car yet, out of interest?
If so, you presumably enjoyed it to the point you want one?

I also note you're in Cumbria.
That's frustratingly close to Scotland, where the government provides 6 years 0% interest loans to buy EVs.
And free charging (for now).

Another unknown factor is Brexit.
Porsche have announced that even for ordered cars the price may rise by 10% after Brexit so if that happens all German cars could be increasing in price? Or not!

Andy Beats wrote: Thu Feb 21, 2019 2:56 pm I also note you're in Cumbria.
That's frustratingly close to Scotland, where the government provides 6 years 0% interest loans to buy EVs.
And free charging (for now).

Until they run out of money!

barrywi wrote: Thu Feb 21, 2019 3:08 pm Until they run out of money!

I'm sure these offers will come to an end, of course.
But still in place just now and a great incentive.