Used GTI+ OR Brand New R-Line (Fully Specced)

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MrTomOates
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Used GTI+ OR Brand New R-Line (Fully Specced)

Post by MrTomOates » Wed Jul 01, 2020 5:20 am

Do I get a USED (at most 2 years old) with low miles POLO GTI+ (£18,000-£21,000) or a fully specced R-Line 95 TSI (£25,087)

Background Information

I'm at STAGE 2 of the ordering process (awaiting a build week date).

I had originally ordered a WHITE/SILVER R-Line POLO TSI 95.
However, after pestering daily for a SLI number (confirmation order form) and after 3 weeks of giving the dealership the deposit; I found out that the car HAD NOT been ordered due to COVID 19 - the production of WHITE/SILVER had been stopped. Therefore, on the phone the day I was informed, I changed the colour immediately to PURE WHITE. Days past by, I wasn't happy with the colour and contacted the salesman who is dealing with my order and had him change it to LIMESTONE GREY (last week). I also asked if he could change my engine from a 95TSI to a 115TSI, however, he changed the colour to LIMESTONE GREY but couldn't change to the 115TSI because production has stopped for the 115 (I feel this is false information).

The salesman isn't really helpful when it comes to information on the car, progress and just general communication. I have this vibe that he really is not interested in my business since he has my deposit and a e-signature to confirm the contract.

Here's the dilemma part

6th June 2020 - Car Ordered
31st December 2020 - Estimated Delivery Date
1st July 2020 - Stage 2 (awaiting build date)

I need your non-bias and honest help.

Do you think it's possible to cancel the order at VW for the NEW R-Line and receive my deposit back if I was to go for the GTI+ or am I too late to do that?
What do you reckon I should do?

Is it better to have the fully specced R-Line with all the features I want than to have a GTI+ and have only a few of the features? I'm re-reading what I put and I sound like a spoilt brat but I like knowing that the car is brand new and nobody other than myself will have used it and I created it, however, the GTI+ just thrills me and excites me to think I could own one (just not brand new)

MrTomOates
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Re: Used GTI+ OR Brand New R-Line (Fully Specced)

Post by MrTomOates » Wed Jul 01, 2020 5:22 am

Any help or suggestions would be absolutely appreciated.

Thanks guys!

PS. The GTI/GTI+ you all own are incredible, checking the 'Post Photo's' thread and seeing such amazing cars! :D

monkeyhanger
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Re: Used GTI+ OR Brand New R-Line (Fully Specced)

Post by monkeyhanger » Wed Jul 01, 2020 6:17 am

What is going to thrill you more? A fast and dynamic handling 200ps car with pretty much all the toys you would practically need, or a 95ps variant that has more toys and will cost you a lot more in depreciation because those toys will retain 20% of the cost at best after 3 years so you'll be paying all of that cost over your PCP?

GTI+ has: LED headlights and rear lights, ACC, digital cockpit/virtual dashboard, better brakes with added Moo, bigger alloys, auto lights, auto dimming rear view mirror, folding wing mirrors, keyless, all the GTI embellishments like the flat bottom steering wheel, 2 stage adjustable suspension, sport seats with lumbar support. There are probably a few other things I've forgotten.

Why a 1-2 year old GTI+ when that fully loaded R-line will cost more than a new GTI+? Is it the money or just wanting to get one now and not wait 6-8 months for one?

If only your timing had been a little better - 10 days ago I traded in my 22 month old 2018 GTI+ with 18" Brescia wheels and 13k miles towards a July 2019 Audi A4 Avant (family needs - we still have another GTI+). You could've had it for £16k, it's probably up on the forecourt for £19k (couldn't find it in a search with Lookers).

Aube
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Re: Used GTI+ OR Brand New R-Line (Fully Specced

Post by Aube » Wed Jul 01, 2020 6:37 am

Hi,

I’ve had the ‘wake up in a sweat have I done the right thing‘ more than once, and spent hours talking to everyone and their dog! But in the end I gave myself a slap, sat down and worked out what I actually what from the car. The GTI+ is a great car and you will enjoy it everyday, but is this the car for you or would a brand new R-Line meet your needs? Also the R-Line will be a brand new car, contribution towards the finance, a two service offer, and worry free motoring for 3 years. The GTI+ is two years old and hopefully has bee looked after, but you have to consider the warranty has one year left, and also the servicing cost and any ongoing bills to cover the unknown.

I think as you haven’t really decided what you want to begin with. Changing colour and the engines is the first sign that you need to do a bit more homework on your preferences. Next, and this would be very annoying, was to find out the order hasn’t been placed! Then as you are annoyed, as I would be, start looking for an alternative as now it looks like you plan for a car has been destroyed. And the salesman may have lost interest or possibly is too busy or even not skilled enough to look deeper and find you a car.

Personally, I would sit down at home and work out if the R-Line or the GTI+ is the car I want and then once that decision is made go back to the dealer and say this is what I want and work out a deal. Hopefully on the new car you looked at sites like Carwow who work with dealers to offer a great discount. Use this to negotiate the best price. Also as I mentioned there are finance contributions and service deals available on new cars, and these are always worth taking even if you don’t need to use finance. I have explained in the past how to withdraw from a finance agreement within 14 days of signing that still gets you the contribution, doesn’t affect your credit rating and only costs you around £20 in finance charges.

I’ve been in your situation more than once, so I can relate to your dilemma.

Good luck.

lancslad1985
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Re: Used GTI+ OR Brand New R-Line (Fully Specced)

Post by lancslad1985 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 7:08 am

The lesson I’ve had from buying cars is get the car you want. Sure, you can compromise on the odd option if it comes quicker, but don’t get a lower model or higher model just because it makes sense to if you like cars and enjoy driving. I’ve done this before and then say there thinking “I wish I’d just”.

If you want the r line get the r line. If you’d prefer a gti get that. A fully loaded r line is more than a gti plus was all we were saying, but get the car YOU want that’s within your means.

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Re: Used GTI+ OR Brand New R-Line (Fully Specced)

Post by POLO Clive » Wed Jul 01, 2020 7:22 am

You originally wanted a new R-line, but you also seem to be happy to purchase a used car, so buy a used R-line, you'll save money and get it much sooner (well as soon as you find the right one), but look for the 115ps, the R-line deserves the best engine available to the model.

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Re: Used GTI+ OR Brand New R-Line (Fully Specced)

Post by The Random Dan » Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:28 am

If you paying over £25k for a polo thats not the colour you really want or the engine You really want and have to wait till December for it then might aswell not bother.

Personally you way better off getting a GTI+, especially if you were already willing to pay £25k+ On an R-line then you could afford a brand new GTI+

I don’t know where abouts your based but my local dealer where I got mine from has a brand new GTI+ in Black, Pano roof, beats audio, 18” wheels, £26k and its instock ready for immediate delivery

https://www.swanswaygarages.com/volkswa ... g-s-s-5dr/

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iichel
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Re: Used GTI+ OR Brand New R-Line (Fully Specced)

Post by iichel » Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:48 am

The choice between the R-Line or the GTI+ will probably boil down to whether you want a normal vroom vroom or a very fast vroom vroom.
Personally I'd never buy a new car for financial reasons, the depreciation when leaving the showroom is something I don't like.

Why not get a used R-Line with all the boxes ticked?

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Re: Used GTI+ OR Brand New R-Line (Fully Specced)

Post by RUM4MO » Wed Jul 01, 2020 9:46 am

A badly thought out "next car" buying plan, I've always done all the thinking before going near a dealership, and must confess that I've always looked into what the new car I wanted would cost if bought via a broker, so that means you only end up visiting the dealership once with your typed out "proposal to buy" that defines the actual car down to the extras and colour and the only price that I'm going to pay, that usually works if you have done all your homework wisely and remembered that no dealership is going to lose money on a sale.

We have 2 cars in our garage normally, a smaller lower powered runabout for all short > medium journeys and the first car to be used if both of us are needing to use a car at the same time, that car tends to be spec'd up with any options that appeal, currently that car is an August 2015 Polo 1.2TSI SEL 6 speed, the other car is a February 2011 Audi S4 6 speed, that car was chosen as a kind of a play thing and for longer journeys and it has very few options included - but then it does come standard with all the good things that I'd want.

So, what is the primary use that you have for this car and is it the only only car that you will have access to, that is maybe what should help you decide which of these Polos best suits you, the used GTI+ will get to the age that you feel it needs replaced by sooner than the not built yet new R- Line, but if like me and my 2011 S4, you will not be using it every day and not stacking up the miles on it, then maybe you would hold onto a bought now used GT+ longer than a not built yet new R - Line .

In my case, the 2015 Polo 1.2TSI SEL 110PS will be due for replacement a lot sooner than the much older S4, one is more a house tool, the other is more a toy that has uses.

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Re: Used GTI+ OR Brand New R-Line (Fully Specced)

Post by monkeyhanger » Wed Jul 01, 2020 9:55 am

iichel wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:48 am
The choice between the R-Line or the GTI+ will probably boil down to whether you want a normal vroom vroom or a very fast vroom vroom.
Personally I'd never buy a new car for financial reasons, the depreciation when leaving the showroom is something I don't like.

Why not get a used R-Line with all the boxes ticked?
Buying new needn't be such a burden if you buy the right car, with decent discount and strong used residuals.

Up until 10 days ago, every car I've bought since 1999 had been new. Performance VWS with 12-15% off list and then a drop down to 50-60% of new RRP for trade-in value at 3 years old. That's manageable depreciation.

The best car for this was my 2015 Golf R. List price of £32k, bought for £28k after discount and sold for £17.3k at 46 months old to a performance car dealer who sold it for £20k. That was a bit better than most Rs because it had the Pretoria wheels that everyone wants and a manual gearbox (rare as hens teeth). That car depreciated by £220 a month average while I owned it.

If you buy a GTI+ at a healthy broker sized discount (£21k) and get £12-13k in 3 years time for it, you've done OK. When a 1 year old example is selling for 80% of RRP and you can get a brand new one for 86% RRP, buying a year lld one doesn't make much sense to me unless you're avoiding the wait.

If you're reliant on PCP finance, you'll get a far better APR rate on a new one too.

Some cars have a huge initial depreciation - the A4 I just bought is a prime example of that. Its a £41.3k car at RRP and I bought used, 10.5 months old and 10300 miles on the clock for £25.2k. No way i'd buy that car new unless I was getting a £12k discount on it (£8k was achievable). It'll lose no more than £3k a year for the next 3 years.

I'd definitely buy a GTI+ new and add only the 18" wheels (they will retain value at trade in time). Everything handy you'd need is on the GTI+. Everything else is just toys that will add £££ to your monthlies.

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Re: Used GTI+ OR Brand New R-Line (Fully Specced)

Post by monkeyhanger » Wed Jul 01, 2020 11:22 am

I forgot to add to the OP - Have you got a part ex you need rid of? If not, you should definitely go buy via a Broker e.g. Drivethrdeal for the best possible price.

If you don't have a part ex to get shot of and do want to go the broker route (both ours were bought from Listers Nuneaton and trailered up to Newcastle. First was bought via drivethe deal who introduced me to Listers), don't say you're going elsewhere cheaoer - that'll just antagonise the salesperson and dealership.

You might not get your deposit back, although at this stage the desler isn't financially put out, you've just wasted a bit of their time. It would be harsh and unjustified of them to retain anything beyond a token amount for the sakesperson's time. Even then, if they want to consider you as a potential future customer they shouldn't morally do it.

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Re: Used GTI+ OR Brand New R-Line (Fully Specced)

Post by MrTomOates » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:04 pm

Hi guys,

Really overwhelmed by the amount of you that took time out of your day to respond, thank you!

At first it was quite obvious that the only option was to go for the GTI+, however, I think a few of you started to mention the age of the used car and whether the previous owner looked after it, meaning it's a bit of a gamble in a way especially as well with the warranty only having a year left and then beyond that, if anything was to happen to the car it could be a very expensive problem.

In response to some of you asking about a part-exchange. I do have a car to part-exchange. I have a Vauxhall Corsa SRI 1.4 which is estimated to be valued at £5,000. This however, is through PCP and I do have £3,800 left on the final payment so I do have some equity to use for a deposit.

I'm 22 years of age, a graduate and a newly qualified PE Teacher - I'm not sure whether to have an R-Line Polo which is BRAND NEW and fully specced on PCP because financially it's probably the sensible option because of the limitations of a USED car. I'd hate to find that after the warranty is up on the GTI+, I find that the car has more faults than miles driven. Maybe once I have settled and matured with a financially stabled job with money flying in and out of every hole in my body then that's when I should look at getting a brand new GTI+ in 3/4 years time.

Do you guys reckon that's the sensible option? Maybe at the age of 26 when my PCP on the R-Line runs out, that's when I'll need a GTI+ to make me feel like I'm not getting old. :lol:

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Re: Used GTI+ OR Brand New R-Line (Fully Specced)

Post by SRGTD » Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:13 pm

@MrTomOates; the new car option is the lower risk option if you’re looking to avoid potentially expensive repair costs on a used car with less warranty. However, to throw another option into the mix (apologies for doing this!), you could always get a VW Extended Warranty when the factory warranty runs out on the GTI+.

Aftermarket warranties in general (e.g. Warranty Direct, MotorEasy, Warrantywise and the like) tend to get a bad press, but feedback on VW’s own Extended Warranty by members on various VW forums who’ve bought it is by and large very positive. The VW Extended Warranty is an insurance product providing cover against sudden and unexpected mechanical and electrical failure in the same way that other aftermarket warranty products are. However, I’d feel more confident with a warranty product that’s backed by VW Financial Services that I would with a product from the likes of Warranty Direct.

With the VW product, you can choose the level of cover - Named Component cover or All Component cover, and the excess level, and the cost varies depending on the cover level and excess you choose. The age of the car and mileage / service history may also be factors that influence the price. It won’t be as comprehensive as the original three year factory warranty that comes with a new car, but it could give peace of mind against unexpected mechanical and electrical failures.

https://www.volkswagen.co.uk/owners/my-car/warranties

https://www.insurewithvolkswagen.co.uk/ ... nav_v1.pdf

I don’t have a vested interest in suggesting the extended warranty option (I’m not affiliated in any way with VW Financial Services 😁), nor did I purchase the extended warranty when the 3 year factory warranty expired on my car. However, IMO it’s something that might be worth considering.

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Re: Used GTI+ OR Brand New R-Line (Fully Specced)

Post by The Random Dan » Wed Jul 01, 2020 3:49 pm

Still don’t understand why it has to be a Used GTI+ ???

The price your paying for an R-Line is more than a GTI+. I purchased a brand new GTI+ in Red with 18” wheels and rear camera in February this year for under £21k

Their are dealers out there with them in stock, you might have to travel a bit but certainly worth looking at

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Re: Used GTI+ OR Brand New R-Line (Fully Specced)

Post by monkeyhanger » Wed Jul 01, 2020 4:58 pm

MrTomOates wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:04 pm
Hi guys,

Really overwhelmed by the amount of you that took time out of your day to respond, thank you!

At first it was quite obvious that the only option was to go for the GTI+, however, I think a few of you started to mention the age of the used car and whether the previous owner looked after it, meaning it's a bit of a gamble in a way especially as well with the warranty only having a year left and then beyond that, if anything was to happen to the car it could be a very expensive problem.

In response to some of you asking about a part-exchange. I do have a car to part-exchange. I have a Vauxhall Corsa SRI 1.4 which is estimated to be valued at £5,000. This however, is through PCP and I do have £3,800 left on the final payment so I do have some equity to use for a deposit.

I'm 22 years of age, a graduate and a newly qualified PE Teacher - I'm not sure whether to have an R-Line Polo which is BRAND NEW and fully specced on PCP because financially it's probably the sensible option because of the limitations of a USED car. I'd hate to find that after the warranty is up on the GTI+, I find that the car has more faults than miles driven. Maybe once I have settled and matured with a financially stabled job with money flying in and out of every hole in my body then that's when I should look at getting a brand new GTI+ in 3/4 years time.

Do you guys reckon that's the sensible option? Maybe at the age of 26 when my PCP on the R-Line runs out, that's when I'll need a GTI+ to make me feel like I'm not getting old. :lol:

Like "The random Dan", i'm struggling to see why you are comparing affordability for a used (or new) Polo GTI+ at £21k vs paying £25087 for a fully loaded R-Line. How can you afford a £25k R-line yet not afford a £21k GTI+?

Your spec you are after (as seen on the delivery times/best colour thread) is to be frank, completely nuts for a Polo. That car must be costing a fortune on a monthly basis because of losing all that money on the optional extras that carry almost no residual value at trade-in time.

Lets put it in perspective:-

A standard spec manual 1.0 95ps R-Line has an RRP of £19505 and a guaranteed future value (GFV) at the end of your PCP of £7660. If you pay RRP, and get that £2000 deposit contribution, the car will lose £9845 in 3 years between whatever deposit you put down and your 35 monthlies. Lets say you put down £3463 as per the finance calculator on the VW website, you've got 32 payments of £235.20 (due to the 3 months are free offer on at the moment).

Lets do that again with your fully loaded one. GFV is still the same, VW make no allowance for options on the finance pages, but you should see (if you're lucky) a grand more for your £5500 of options at trade in time.

So now you have a £25087 car that's worth £7660 after 3 years. That fully loaded car (taking into account the £2000 deposit contribution) will lose £15427 in 3 years.

If you're putting down the same deposit, your fully loaded car is £440.92 a month vs the basic spec at £235.20 a month.It's costing you almost twice as much just to add £5500 spec to a £19500 car. That is completely insane.

If £25087 is the price you're actually paying rather than RRP quoted, the dealership is offering you absolutely no discount. That is a terrible deal.

If you're prepared to put down £3500 of your own money and £440 a month in PCP, you could have a discounted brand new Golf R for that If you can find any unsold stock of the MK7.5.


You'd be much better off with a Polo GTI+

Lets look at your list of extras:-

- Panoramic Sunroof - As a driver, there's not much benefit to having one of these as you'll be spending all your time looking forward and not up. They're a cause of creaks, rattles and leaks - Sunroofs are a PITA
- Winter Pack - Heated front seats and a washer fluid level. Do you feel the cold in your car in winter? Might be appreciated on leather seats, but on cloth seats, why bother.
- LED Headlights - Standard on the GTI+, don't need to spec
- Active Info Display - Standard on the GTI+, don't need to spec
- Allow Wheels 17" - Standard on the GTI+, don't need to spec
- Climate Control - Personal preference, didn't see the need to spec.
- Keyless Entry with Start/Stop - Standard on the GTI+, don't need to spec
- Driving Profile Selection - Standard on the GTI+, don't need to spec
- Park Assist including Sensors - Standard on the GTI+, don't need to spec
- Rear-view Camera - What is the point? A Polo is tiny and you've got parking sensors. I had this on my Polo because I grabbed a Polo off the system that had it specced. I wouldn't have specced it myself.
- Discover Navigation System - Personal preference - do you use Nav a lot? If not, just use Goggle maps for occasional use, VW Nav needs manually updating every 6 months, which some can find daunting.I had this on my Polo because I grabbed a Polo off the system that had it specced, but wouldn't have specced myself, I used it twice - Goggle maps is better.

So even at full RRP, lets compare your R-Line with the Polo GTI+, purely for the options that the GTI+ has as standard:-

Polo GTI+ RRP = £24875

R-Line 95ps Manual with LED lights, active info display, 17" alloy wheels, keyless, driver profile, park assist RRP = £21795

So the GTI+ is about £3100 more like for like with the spec the GTI has as standard.

The GTI+ has a few other things that you haven't got there - Sports seats with lumbar support, Dual mode dampers (Sport and comfort), Active Cruise Control and the GTI steering wheel, other GTI touches....AND 111% more power .

The GTI+ has a GFV of around £11500 last time I looked, so even though it's £3100 more in RRP:-

The difference between RRP and GFV for the GTI+ is £11875 (accounting for the deposit contribution)

The difference between RRP and GFV for the partially specced R-Line is £12135 (accounting for the deposit contribution)

The R-Line will cost you more than the GTI+ whether you partially spec or fully spec.

All these numbers are based on paying full RRP (which it seems you are), rather than getting a decent discount.

If you were to buy a GTI+ with broker levels of discount, keep it simple (maybe the alloy wheels, metallic paint and your heated seats) and got rid of your Corsa through WBAC if the value is more than GFV or what you owe on it, you could be paying around £21.5K for it, or around £270 a month with £3k of your own money as deposit.
Last edited by monkeyhanger on Wed Jul 01, 2020 6:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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