VCDS?

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wolfie
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VCDS?

Post by wolfie »

At the moment all I have with regards to diagnostic tools is an uber cheapo OBDII Bluetooth gizmo which to be honest it next to useless. Been thinking about biting the bullet and purchasing VCDS. It seems to be the go-to tool for VAG diagnostics. Thing is as a fix it when it breaks/weekend warrior it looks expensive, especially now they've switched to limited license versions. Even the 3 license version weighs in at £225. Secondhand unlimited versions are as rare as Unicorn droppings and when they do appear they are stupid money.

To be honest, though powerful VSDS looks very dated. It doesn't look like the user interface has been updated since windows 95 was doing the rounds. Also is VCDS limited to strictly VAG or does it have some limited functionality on other vehicles? I thought OBDII was common across the board? £225 for something that is tied to 3 cars and one manufacturer doesn't sound like a good deal. I was considering an alternative like a Launch 129E or one of the Foxwell devices as a alternative. Outwardly I'm not a fan of the Bluetooth gizmos as they appear to charge extra for anything other than very basic functions.

What are you lot using?
amer6R
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Re: VCDS?

Post by amer6R »

Well maybe it looks dated, but is really simple to use, and very useful.
You can check carly. Yes vcds has generic obd for other cars but it will read only dtc faults its really useless compated to any other universal diagnostic tool. Also you can check readyness status.
Also VCP, i think its similar to vcds and has far more abilities
wolfie
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Re: VCDS?

Post by wolfie »

amer6R wrote: Sun May 09, 2021 9:58 am Well maybe it looks dated, but is really simple to use, and very useful.
Aye that's just me being grumbly, nit picking and tight. :lol: :lol: Though I don't understand why it looks so dated when they roll out updates reasonably frequently?

It just looks costly now £225 for 3 license. £300 for 10, and £450 for unlimited. If I was a small garage, £450 would sound like a bargain, but for a DIYer that might only use it a couple of times a year it's an expensive tool.

I'd not seen VCP, so cheers.
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iichel
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Re: VCDS?

Post by iichel »

i'm a happy vcds user and yes, there are more powerful tools.
the advantage of vcds is it's low threshold to use it. yes it looks simple, works well on a touch screen, does most you need to and is well documentend.
it fall short of vcp or odis for editing flash/eeprom but in 99% of the cases, you're perfectly fine without it.
the major advantage of vcds is the community and the forum.
heftyshooly
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Re: VCDS?

Post by heftyshooly »

There is also OBDeleven, which is significantly cheaper. Not really comparable to VCDS in terms of support or community, but the same funcionality if you're a DIYer.
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iichel
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Re: VCDS?

Post by iichel »

yes there is a point to be made for obd11, however i feel like vcds has more identified bits and bytes. which is slowly becoming obsolete due to the SFD and MQB platorms.
amer6R
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Re: VCDS?

Post by amer6R »

With carly you can do other brands and it supports cars like golf 7 etc.
If i wouldnt pick vcds or vcp, and want a original tool.I would pick carly and pair it with a tablet. Its not expensive and the licence is cheap.
You always get warranty with original tools and that is a huge +
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Re: VCDS?

Post by RUM4MO »

I've been a VCDS user almost from the beginning, in my case it saved me quite a bit of money as I personally imported a VW Passat in mid 2000 and within a year I discovered that various options had not been enabled as they would be for the UK market, and surprise surprise my local VW dealership, even though I registered that car with VW UK, told me that I needed to allow them to buy a new instrument cluster and they would need to program it to solve my problems, roughly £400 back in early 2001, at that time VAG COM cost me roughly £190, so I used that to end up with what VW wanted £400+ for, so for me, the initial cost made it worth it. By mid 2002 we became a "3 VW Group car" family, and still are so I have not grudged updating twice both times trading my older system in - though if I was smarter I would have sold the older systems on the open market for almost what I paid for them it seems!

Even replacing the battery requires access to diagnostics kit, though in the future that requirement will possibly disappear as long as you fit "like" for "like". Resetting the service indicator needs a diagnostic tool to clear the "inspection" warning I think, normal service warning does not.

I tend or tended to retro fit some options to be the same as factory fitted, so some coding is needed - as well as the obvious engine warning light that used to come on frequently on some cars, or even in the past a brake light out logging a fault - etc etc.

I'd think that a bluetooth/wifi dongle plus phone would end up being cheaper for you over time even although you need to drip feed them, I think with cash, I've got Carista for use "on the road" with a dongle in each car(cheap deal on official dongles at the time) and as I was an early adopter, I don't need to pay extra for using certain of its functions - which is good as , if I remember, when working on friends cars, I don't need to use up "a life" of my VCDS license to carry out some tasks.
wolfie
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Re: VCDS?

Post by wolfie »

RUM4MO wrote: Sun May 09, 2021 11:13 pm I'd think that a bluetooth/wifi dongle plus phone would end up being cheaper for you over time even although you need to drip feed them, I think with cash, I've got Carista for use "on the road" with a dongle in each car(cheap deal on official dongles at the time) and as I was an early adopter, I don't need to pay extra for using certain of its functions - which is good as , if I remember, when working on friends cars, I don't need to use up "a life" of my VCDS license to carry out some tasks.
That sort of sums up my view on these little gizmos/tools. Maybe I'm just getting old but the whole constant drip feeding of additional monies on top of the original purchase fee has just become the way of the world. What happened to buying something and it being yours? Don't get me wrong, I'm not adverse to paying for updates are required, just makes me feel like I'm being taken for a mug. However nigh on all of the Bluetooth devices now go down that path. Carly, Carista, OBDeleven, to name a few. That's not so bad if the initial purchase price is kept low, but some of these tools weigh in at up to £70+ anyway, and that is before unlocking some of the more advanced features. Also from what I've seen they have a "PlayStation Generation" feel to them with how the display the information. Again maybe I'm just old and tight.

VCDS would definitely be my tool of choice had it not been for the re-jigging of the pricing structure. What with friends and family, the 3 license version would be used up before it was taken out of the box. So that bumps you up to the £300, for the 10 license version. Again cheap if you are a little garage, but for occasional use it feels too much. It becomes a toss-up. Do you buy a tool, diagnose it yourself and hope you have the means to fix it. Or send it to the garage with a hope the bill doesn't hit £300.

I guess you won't be able to answer the question with yours being an early unrestricted version, but what function are still available to unrestricted use? I'm pretty sure adaptions of any kind get culled. The other issue for the price is the VAG only use. While not as all encompassing in the function as VCDS there appear to be some halfway decent devices at the £300 point that support many of manufacturers. Foxwell, Ancel and Launch appear to offer some reasonable devices around the price.

Dunno??? I have a couple of little niggles that I'd like to look at and having a diagnostic tool would be a big help. But my inner Scrooge can't justify £300 at the moment.
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Re: VCDS?

Post by RUM4MO »

With Carista, I'm sure that "adaption" , re-setting service warnings and battery registering are all either extra cost each time you need to use them and/or available only with the Pro license, reading fault codes and clearing them will be free within the basic level purchase.

VCDS does seem to hold a lot of its value so it can be easily and legally sold on to the next user who can register it in their name, because I am not always on VCDS forums, I missed a trick at the 20th birthday as they were selling "conversion kits" very cheaply, ie I could have converted my 10 VIN license to an unlimited at a very reasonable rate - which would have freed me up to help others out at a small cost and also have a more sellable bit of kit to sell on when the time comes - but I only found out about that too late!

I'm just glad in a way that I had a very good reason to want to buy VCDS, when VW sent out the "new car feedback thing" to my wife after I bought her a new Polo in 2015, she passed it on to me to fill in, in one section maybe headed "why did you buy a Volkswagen as your next car?" I replied on behalf of my wife "because my husband owns VCDS diagnostic tool!" - maybe I had my tongue in my cheek when I wrote that, but that was 75% part of the reason to stick with VW Group cars, ie having VCDS provides you with a bit of freedom to assist with fault finding and also to check the car's fault logs while in warranty and before handing it in for repair or service.

My older daughter's May 2019 SEAT Cupra was bought in August 2019 as a pre reg'd but unused car, it came to her "riddled" with logged faults that would have normally meant her booking it in to get looked at instead of being used to travel to and from work - I worked out most of the codes were due to very little PDI work as many of these fault codes were acquired at initial build and others due to the battery being drained while in storage.

With the current way that VCDS has become limited VIN wise, I would never offer to help anyone out where it meant that I would use up a VIN, without me charging them maybe £35 - it is just not worth it, I did carry out battery registration for an ex-work friend over a year ago on his December 2016 Audi A6, and that used up a VIN, something that I had not thought about - his garage just replaced the battery and did not know or bother to change the serial number, but I took that on the chin as it was my first opportunity to actually register a new battery - so I gained from that before I ever need to do the same with any of our family cars locally.
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Re: VCDS?

Post by wolfie »

RUM4MO wrote: Tue May 11, 2021 12:19 am
With the current way that VCDS has become limited VIN wise, I would never offer to help anyone out where it meant that I would use up a VIN, without me charging them maybe £35 - it is just not worth it, I did carry out battery registration for an ex-work friend over a year ago on his December 2016 Audi A6, and that used up a VIN, something that I had not thought about - his garage just replaced the battery and did not know or bother to change the serial number, but I took that on the chin as it was my first opportunity to actually register a new battery - so I gained from that before I ever need to do the same with any of our family cars locally.
I find the whole pricing structure somewhat skewed now. I think there are a great many folk that used to buy these who were only too happy to help out a mate for free. I really don't want to be asking friends and mates to chip in because it's cost me a life, so to speak.

Like yourself I have one eye on the future. If I was 100% certain my next car would be from the VAG group I would probably bite the bullet and buy a 10 license version. As it is, my circumstances have changed over the past few years so chances are current Polo will be run into the ground, if it last longer than I do. I guess I've this arbitrary figure set in my head that I think is a reasonable sum for a DIY tool.

I'm not really interested in doing any coding, though being able to adopt new settings is sort of essential. Some of the non-VCSD devices have limited capability in that area so I may do some more digging. Failing finding something suitable. It's looking more and more like I will end up running my car into the local indie and some point to check out my niggles. That sort of irritates me as I'm pretty sure that if I could diagnose the fault and could fix it myself.
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Re: VCDS?

Post by wolfie »

Just a quick question that I am unclear of with regards to VCDS.

Should the gods smile on me and I find a second hand VCDS interface at reasonable money. I read somewhere but can't find it again grrrr.... I need to re-register as the new owner??

That there is a $99!! charge for Ross-Tech to switch ownership? (which sort of sounds like daylight robbery) If that is the case, second hand doesn't look such a good idea.
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Re: VCDS?

Post by RUM4MO »

Oh, I didn't think that was the case, that sounds a bit naughty for something that has already been paid for by the original owner.

One other thing that I thought about, there is are used to be a version called VCDS Lite, it gave the ability to read and clear faults but no more, that might be all you are interested in, and it might be that that costs $99 to register with, the download will be free.
wolfie
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Re: VCDS?

Post by wolfie »

RUM4MO wrote: Fri May 14, 2021 10:52 pm Oh, I didn't think that was the case, that sounds a bit naughty for something that has already been paid for by the original owner.

One other thing that I thought about, there is are used to be a version called VCDS Lite, it gave the ability to read and clear faults but no more, that might be all you are interested in, and it might be that that costs $99 to register with, the download will be free.
Cheers, quite possibly. I've not looked at VCDS-Lite, at all.

As I understand in and may well be wrong, the main issue is with the vin limited interface. If you buy secondhand with however many vins remaining, there is no problem. However, should you need to top-up the vins, then you need to be registered to update the device. It looks like Ross-Tech have twigged this, offering a number of options. Re-register $99. Buy more vins & re-register $199. (Std vin purchase $169)

In a nutshell, to my eye anyway, limited vin versions looks expensive. Unlimited version "new" looks expensive for the DIY'er, but pretty cheap for a garage @ £480.

Problem is folk have twigged the limited vin pricing is expensive so second hand interfaces are commanding silly money. Also folk are getting their fingers burned with counterfeit versions. I'm happy to buy stuff off EBay when it's £20-30, but not sure I'd be wanting to chance £250+ on something with questionable origin. (Plus I'm not clued up enough to ask the appropriate questions to weed out the genuine article)
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Re: VCDS?

Post by RUM4MO »

Another thought, if you don't think that you will end up buying another VW Group car that is much newer, then you could buy second hand a legit version of VCDS CAN + USB or some other close named earlier versions.

The original reason that I upgraded to the latest VCDS version was that my daughter bought a May 2019 Seat Cupra and I knew that some of its controllers would not be able to be read using my older version of VCDS, the older versions have no VIN limitations but will not be able to talk to the newer controllers in for instance that 2019 SEAT Leon, my wife's 2015 6C Polo and my 2011 Audi S4 were fully covered, but if I bought my wife a new Polo today it would not be fully covered nor would my mate's 2018 VW T-Roc.
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