Questions performance upgrades 1.6 CR TDI

[Amig]

Hello everyone,

This is my first topic here and i hope you guys can help me out in some way!

First off i am the proud owner of a Polo 6R 1.6TDI 105CR but as most of you will already know it misses that punch on longer stretches of road. So I am in the process of saving up for some serious engine mods being:

Garrett vnt17 turbo upgrade (from 2.0 TDI with different actuator to actually work)
Wagner tuning intercooler (is actually for GTI/WRC but will fit the TDI also)
Custom downpipe/DPF delete, rest of exhaust will also be changed out to slightly bigger diameter
Custom intercooler piping
Mapping of course
Single mass flywheel and uprated clutch
Maybe 6-speed gearbox and Limited slip diff

So now for my questions:

Does anyone know if the air deflector and grill to airbox tubing from a GTI is a direct fit (battery clearance will not be an issue) and also what might be the part number?

Are there already uprated nozzle for sale for the piezo injectors? If yes where to buy and is this a viable option together with my other upgrades?

Any tips,tricks and or handy links are more than welcome!!!

Ow and for the people who might think I'm crazy for putting this much upgrades on my daily driver, yes I am nuts

Eventually the car will be replaced and is gonna function as a track-day only car.

Much thanks for the replies that might follow.

Greetings

Alex

[auds2]

What about your VAG warranty?
Why not just buy a GT

[98octaneblood]

Honestly, I'd sell the TDI and go for a petrol version of the Polo, much easier, dramatically sportier and (I suspect) way cheaper.

[TheFrog]

...way cheaper.

+1 Especially as your TDI will be worthless if you mess about with it like that.

[Amig]

Thank you guys for the input!

As far as my warranty goes the engine has ran almost 45k kms already, after having inspected most parts of the engine I am fairly certain nothing will break and will be covered by warranty. Also by the time I will have all the upgrades and be ready to fit them I won't have warranty anymore since VW will probably throw it wear and tear (been down that road before)

I also understand your opinion on getting a petrol version but I chose the TDI for a few specific reasons:

Reliability, the twincharged engine does not have the reputation of being that.
Lower fuel cost
Better mpg, since when the power is not needed the engine does not have to compensate for higher airflow during partial load since Diesel engines have a very wide range of fuel range etc.

This makes it a perfect endurance trackday car, that is after it first loses some weight have a steroid diet together with some chassis improvements and a decent drop.

Other things,
TDI technology made VW/VAG very succesfull
TDI technology is to me very interesting, fact being that the newest generations petrol engines use technology that flow over from innovations that were primarily developed for Diesel engines. Can anyone say supercharger

And lastly but most importantly: this car is the first car I bought ever brand new from the dealership. I worked very hard for it. So I'm very proud of that, (I know that sounds weird but I grew up seeing my friends get sick cars from their parents while waiting for them to finally pick me up to go hang and taking the bus for an hour to school/work everyday while it's actually a 5-10 min drive.. Therefore I decided to not let it go.. Ever!!

As stated before I am a bit nuts

[Amig]

Please explain worthless?

Because to me it is worth every penny I put in because i can enjoy working on the car and maintaining it properly and most of all enjoy having the quickest TDI polo and probably eat GT's and GTI's..

And if everybody always chose the "easy" option wouldn't the world be super boring?

Anyway I thought this was a car enthousiast forum... You guys don't sound very enthausiastic..

Anyone else please have some serious input and useful knowledge about this series of TDI engines?

[wolfie]

+1 Especially as your TDI will be worthless if you mess about with it like that.

+1+1... Don't understand the logic here either. Why spend a shed load of money on a slower model with various Heath-Robbinson, go faster mods bolted on that will make the car practically worthless. Instead of just putting the money aside and buying a better performing model, with a factory warranty and good residuals??

[auds2]

What sort of power figures are you expecting ti get with the mods fitted and dialed in?

[Mayhem]

Wouldnt you best just getting it remapped or a tuning box? With it being turbo diesel you will see about an extra 20-30bhp from that alone usually. Dont think diesels are worth uprating things like intercoolers etc imo. anything after a remap will surely want bigger turbos etc which would start to add up to silly money. may be wrong tho. could probably just buy a quicker car. If its going to be track use why not get something cheaper like a fiesta st or focus st rather than create a money pit? But if you love the polo that much go for it. each to their own and all that

[TheFrog]

Please explain worthless?

Worthless to potential purchasers. I don't doubt you will love it to bits, but you will reduce the number of potential buyers by about 95% once they know it's been tinkered with, irrespective of how well the work has been done and how good the result is.

If you can afford to do it, then do it

[saty]

Sounds fantastic, will be a proper sleeper. With all those mods how much bhp are you looking at, 200bhp+? And I was me thinking a remap would be too much for mine..
Excited to see it happen, I find my polo handles pretty well on H&R springs, yours will be a rapid little car once you've finished with it .

[Tooks]

Tuning a diesel is indeed a bit of a dark art, although pretty effective if done right.

A well known tuner close to where I live had an A3 TDI quattro that had all sorts done to it to the extent it used to easily beat its S3 brother, running over 400bhp I think it was.

Your list of mods is pretty extensive, but not sure I'd bother with all of them. I'd probably focus on an exhaust and remap. To get a bit more adventurous, Google LPG secondary injection if you want to see some pretty good gains with lower emissions and cooler cylinder temps.

A limited slip diff would be good on a 2WD car with plenty of torque, as would some suspension mods to handle the heavy engine up front, and don't forget about the brakes. A car with good suspension and great brakes can out perform a big power machine on your average road.

Injectors and intercooler I wouldn't be too bothered with, but a different turbo might be worth a go.

An expert remapper should be able to get some good power with just a decent exhaust/DPF delete though, certainly enough to make it entertaining, and you will need to have a good relationship with them as you'll need to keep remapping after each stage. . After a while, it's diminishing returns though.

All good stuff, but I can't help but feel it's a bit like teaching your dog to speak Norwegian. Very time consuming and a bit pointless...

[Amig]

Thanks guys! Some serious input! As for resale value.... Please read my posts again. Car will not leave my ownership!!
On the whole you should've bought a petrol version, it is gonna be a money pit.. The price difference alone between my car and a GTI or a BGT will buy me all before mentioned parts three or four times over. Fitment will be done by myself.

Warranty is NOT an issue.. PLEASE DO NOT EVER INSTALL A SIMPLE TUNINGBOX ON THE NEW TDI ENGINE! There is documented evidence of them causing bent rods!!! If you want a lil bit more power get a remap if you aim 130-140 with an ic from Seat Ibiza 2.0 TDI !not sure! You can get a little bit more.

I have taken in account that I will need better suspension and brakes, I have factory Gti suspension and brakes (just not painted red) which will be replaced by an eibach pro street coilover set or adjustable bilstein shocks with hr springs. Brakes: first better fluid, front brembo GT 323mm X 28mm, rear standard size rotor slotted and lastly good pads

Front upper strut brace by wiechers
Eibach or ultra racing front rear sway/anti roll bars.
uprated engine mounts

Tuning Diesel engines is indeed a dark art not tinkering

http://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/h ... 1414_o.jpg

From what I've seen on the track around these parts and local tuners is that with a DPF delete, hybrid or 2.0 turbo, proper intercooler to compensate for bigger turbo these engines produce a reliable 170-190 hp and this is without spewing out huge amounts of unburned fuel famous black smoke.... Some even still run the DPF and EGR. So yes my goal is at least 200 and of course must stay reliable. So no propane for me. I know it's benefits, also seen how dangerous it can be... Better of with WMI but then there is the danger of hydro locking if engine is not hot enough. So should be ecu integrated and used as boost function because it helps lower EGT so engine can be pushed a bit more. This is also the big problem of these engines. When pushing them beyond 190 the EGT gets to the point where you are destroying the engine.

So the main goal is lowering pre turbo EGT, having the intake temps at bay with proper intercooler helps but not enough.. Custom ic piping will help maintaining boost and reduce ic pressure drop which is already hardly any..

Downpipe and Exhaust will be free flowing, slightly bigger diameter to eliminate exhaust back pressure...

I also think the injectors will be fine as is. The only thing I can think of then is porting etc and make a custom exhaust turbo manifold... Not a viable option..

Maybe fitting a 2.0 TDI engine would be nice, but then a whole lot of other problems arise...

Still I am planning on getting engine parts first then instal and get it mapped. There are a few good tuners around here and they are up to job and already have experience with these engines..

Ow turbo I can buy of darksidedevelopments. Currently 675£ , already has the right actuator for polo ECU. Only need to buy flexible oil drain. As stated on their site.

[Jamesbluegt]

I'd pay to see "documented evidence" that a tuning box has caused bent rods


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[auds2]

[quote="Jamesbluegt"]I'd pay to see "documented evidence" that a tuning box has caused bent rods

+1 on this Because i think thats utter rubbish that statement.