18 plate polo with no problems to date!

[mike sel]

When you spend out good money for a new car, should you expect problems with it? Luckily with a new car you do have a 3 year warranty (VW).

"mike sel" if your son's looking around for a car with an auto box, don't let him get a ford with (powershift) look on the internet they don't have a good reputation for reliability, if it's a new car they will replace the gearbox once, after that it's up to the owner .

He went for a Golf SV SE 1.2TSI on a 64 plate

[RUM4MO]

Following on from earlier posts, it seems in UK we have a completely different perception of some brands sold in UK when compared with our close European neighbours, for instance, and not because this is a VW based car forum, we place Golf before Focus followed by Astra, from what I've found in mainland Europe, all these cars are considered equals, which they probably are.

It seems weird that we continue this way of thinking considering that there are now no British branded cars being sold in the mainstream market, maybe that is due to us in general starting to hate Ford and Vauxhall for running down or out car manufacture in Britain, even although these two companies still manufacture significant numbers of parts/assemblies in Britain.

Edit:- going back to me claiming that CZ located parts/assemblies limit Polo's life expectations, I stand by that but, while Skoda and certain some Skoda companies manufacture some of the best tram systems and other road vehicles round, it does look like when VW took them over, they left quite a lot of the wrong decision makers in jobs within Skoda cars division, and that has meant that when it came to delivering a new cheap small car that VW could copy into other marques, a very nasty little turd of a car (Fabia) was what they came up with! Now VW must have rubbed their hands with joy with the chance to dump the old reliable but probably a bit expensive to manufacture Polos up to that point, last one being the 6N version, and the chance to mug their Polo buyers with this new cheap to manufacture Fabia based car for the selling price a bit above their previous Polo versions. Problems appeared quite soon after the launch of 9N Polo were the perceived "VW toughness and quality" was just not there but the Polo name backed with the VW brand just meant that these cars sold as well as previous Polos.
Most of these issues were caused by 20/21st century small car design being applied by a former Soviet type country's manufacturing sector and being supplied in the main with raw materials typical of that type of country, the worst of these important raw materials being some of the steels used for solid assemblies and fasteners, quite shocking really when compared with German cars built using Germany and Western European sourced parts/assemblies! This will not apply to all Skodas being built as most of them are based on existing Germany built cars and so all the running gear will get sourced form the same sources as VW used originally - and it is the running gear and some engines that will continue to blight Polo and Ibiza - but cars fly out the delaer's doors so VW Group care not one bit, good job well done.

[stevereeves]

Nutshell: certain Audi , Skoda & VW models are so similar these days. I.e. 3 rolling chassis roll (sorry) off 3 theorectically identical production lines; line 1 it gets an Audi body & a slight different equipment / spec levels, line 2 Skoda & line 3 VW. Same with Citroen, Peugeot & Renault, some models being so similar it's almost ridiculous. Anyone who plays guitar wil prob be aware this situation also applies to Gibson and other, lesser brands, the main differences being the name on the headstock which affects price. VW are still perceived as being high quality brand but other manufactureres have caught up tho VW have reduced quality a bit in. I'd still choose say, A Golf over a Leon, or a Polo over an Ibiza, but if there was onlay few £££'s in price difference it would be a more difficult choice. Audi are still a lot more expensive than VW & especially Skoda but the cars are about the same quality, IMO....

[Leif]

I know you have struggled with yours TBH its one of the reasons why I am surprised my car has had no problems and why I have asked if there I anyone else out there with a Polo 18 plate that works normally. I do feel your pain and am amazed at your patience. I do hope your Polo now pays you back with years of untroubled driving. I am concerned that the cars are so high tec, I do give some mind (not much) too how long the car will go without problems, but I am enjoying driving it so much that I am trusting it will be reliable.

My last three cars all had issues in the first year or two, niggles are a fact of life with most cars, apart from perhaps Toyota and other Japanese makes. As I said earlier, what are the alternatives? We all know that VW are not one of the most reliable makes, they are middle ranking according to most surveys I've seen. Like you, I enjoy driving mine. If there was another car of a similar size, with similar space inside, and more comfortable and quieter, I'd get one.

[Leif]

Nutshell: certain Audi , Skoda & VW models are so similar these days. I.e. 3 rolling chassis roll (sorry) off 3 theorectically identical production lines; line 1 it gets an Audi body & a slight different equipment / spec levels, line 2 Skoda & line 3 VW. Same with Citroen, Peugeot & Renault, some models being so similar it's almost ridiculous. Anyone who plays guitar wil prob be aware this situation also applies to Gibson and other, lesser brands, the main differences being the name on the headstock which affects price. VW are still perceived as being high quality brand but other manufactureres have caught up tho VW have reduced quality a bit in. I'd still choose say, A Golf over a Leon, or a Polo over an Ibiza, but if there was onlay few £££'s in price difference it would be a more difficult choice. Audi are still a lot more expensive than VW & especially Skoda but the cars are about the same quality, IMO....

Indeed. It's clever brand management, to target the thrifty, standard and premium market segments using variations on the same product. From what I've seen VW do use slightly better plastics in the cabin, and noise suppression is better too, compared to Skoda and Seat so it's worth paying a bit more. I'm not convinced by Audi.

[mike sel]

Nutshell: certain Audi , Skoda & VW models are so similar these days. I.e. 3 rolling chassis roll (sorry) off 3 theorectically identical production lines; line 1 it gets an Audi body & a slight different equipment / spec levels, line 2 Skoda & line 3 VW. Same with Citroen, Peugeot & Renault, some models being so similar it's almost ridiculous. Anyone who plays guitar wil prob be aware this situation also applies to Gibson and other, lesser brands, the main differences being the name on the headstock which affects price. VW are still perceived as being high quality brand but other manufactureres have caught up tho VW have reduced quality a bit in. I'd still choose say, A Golf over a Leon, or a Polo over an Ibiza, but if there was onlay few £££'s in price difference it would be a more difficult choice. Audi are still a lot more expensive than VW & especially Skoda but the cars are about the same quality, IMO....

Indeed. It's clever brand management, to target the thrifty, standard and premium market segments using variations on the same product. From what I've seen VW do use slightly better plastics in the cabin, and noise suppression is better too, compared to Skoda and Seat so it's worth paying a bit more. I'm not convinced by Audi.

Im with leif on this one. I feel the noise reduction in the VW polo is far better then the Fabia or Ibeza also the interior is more pleasant in the VW. Audi A1? seriously? I cant tell the difference in quality to that of the Polo. yes there are some different dials and air ducts but not better. If the Japs did a car the same size as the new POLO (no not almost the same just 200mm longer) but exactly the same size and then matched the quality (no not almost I mean matched or improved upon) then I would go that product, but they just don't do one. Lexus is about the same sound proof and interior quality but they don't do one under 4100mm long. nor do any other brand (whilst matching or improving on VW quality).

[monkeyhanger]

Nutshell: certain Audi , Skoda & VW models are so similar these days. I.e. 3 rolling chassis roll (sorry) off 3 theorectically identical production lines; line 1 it gets an Audi body & a slight different equipment / spec levels, line 2 Skoda & line 3 VW. Same with Citroen, Peugeot & Renault, some models being so similar it's almost ridiculous. Anyone who plays guitar wil prob be aware this situation also applies to Gibson and other, lesser brands, the main differences being the name on the headstock which affects price. VW are still perceived as being high quality brand but other manufactureres have caught up tho VW have reduced quality a bit in. I'd still choose say, A Golf over a Leon, or a Polo over an Ibiza, but if there was onlay few £££'s in price difference it would be a more difficult choice. Audi are still a lot more expensive than VW & especially Skoda but the cars are about the same quality, IMO....

Perception of quality and value are big factors - an Audi needn't cost any more in monthlies than the VW, Seat or Skoda equivalent variant. When PCPing, high residuals can make an exoensive car seem reasonable, just like a cheap car can be an expensive proposition with cripplingly high depreciation. When you're covering the depreciation, there's often not a great deal between an A3 and a Seat Leon on a monthly basis. You will of course feel that you've got a better deal when you're in a £28k car for the same monthlies as a £22k car.

Audi gets all the soft squishy plastic where is is readily seen and not so easily seen, Seat get the cheapest and scrstchiest plastics everywhere, and Skoda, trying hard to portray their value for money credentials have a mix of high end switches and vheaper embellishments. Audi nake their money back by making you dip into the options list as they come with nowt!

Early on in the MK7 Golf's life, you could get a GTD for a fiver a month less than the 150ps 2.0 TDI GT - down to the GTD's much higher retained value. The performance models in the VW range do have better residuals than the rest of the range.

The Golf has been undergoing incremental losses of minor things for the last 3 years. The MK7 Golf was so close to the A3 in premium feel when it came out, I wondef if it cannibalised the A3 sales and VW have had to cheapen the Golf a bit.

I don't believe that Skodas are made out of pig iron and monkey metal.

[RUM4MO]

Snip ------ Snip

I don't believe that Skodas are made out of pig iron and monkey metal.

If you were referring to my posting, I think that you will find that what I was saying that the Skoda Fabia running gear inc suspension etc is all sourced from CZ based Skoda suppliers and it is that area that has too many nasty quality metals used, and so all other VW Group marques that share that design of running gear inc suspension are using the same suppliers. On the other hand, as Octavia is based on Golf, its running gear inc suspension is sourced from the same suppliers as VW used for Golf. Which is why I said that Polo and Ibiza and A1's all are limited by their "mother" vehicle which is still a Skoda Fabia, Octavia and Leon A3 on the other hand having a "mother" vehicle which is a VW product and so are not limited in their market place. I used to have a 2000 VW Passat 4Motion and I thought that it was a very good car, it was only after I bought my wife a new Polo 9N in 2002 did I comes to realise that my VW Passat was not a good car because it was a VW, it was because it was mainly an Audi A4 B5, so its strengths came from its "mother" vehicle which was an Audi, same for Skoda Superb and to a lesser extent SEAT Exeo as SEAT got handed a rather badly designed short lifed Audi A4 to make do with!

I'd hope that if you were the sort of person that gets their hands dirty and you ended up needing to take a 4 or 5 year old 9N Polo to bits as your first experience of working on VW Group products, you too would have been more than a bit annoyed by the quality of material used on the running gear inc suspension.

Edit:- I'd expect that the body of these Skoda Fabias was made from strip steel of a similar quality to any other VW group car body though.

[monkeyhanger]

There are many parts that run across multiple platforms. No way that VW would allow parts mainly intended for 1 platform to be significantly lower in quality or durability than that for another. Perhaps in 2001 when Skoda were new to the fold (and even then, I doubt it, VW were looking to drag Skoda up towards their level rather than be dragged down to Skoda's iron curtain standard). Do you think that those VAG parts with Audi stamps are better than those with Skoda stamps, even if either could go into an A4 or a Fabia? VW deal globally, with parts being made all over the World, to defined unified standards. It makes no sense at all to allow the smaller VAG cars with smaller margins to be built to lower standards with inferior parts, to incur a very costly warranty bill. Failure of a 50p part can be a £50 fix under warranty at the dealership.

Czech manufacturing is fine these days, I have worked for a few companies where the Czech sites got the best manufacturing equipment in the group due to lower wage costs meant higher levels of investment and greater profits..

I bought a 9N 1.9TDI from new and it was utterly reliable for 4 years. My cousin bought it off me and ran it another 12 before a bin wagon wrote it off at the end of last year. It needed new shocks at 8 years old and new springs at 11 years old in addition to a battery and a few sets of brake pads and a set of discs. It did 170k miles.

Golfs don't come with better components - I had a MK5 that chewed up steering racks every 6 months, a common problem across that platform (Leons were unaffected).

My current MK7 Golf R has cosmetic rust on most of the steel components on the underside of the car which aren't painted in the body colour (linkages, suspension components etc.). The rear brake disc hubs rusted up almost instantly during ownership and look horrible through the Pretoria wheels. The new thinner hot formed bodywork that debuted on the MQB Golf sized platform made the car feel a bit flimsy and cheap next to the Scirocco I had before I got my GTD in 2013. The Polo doors feel more solid due to less span on same gauge steel.

The Polo GTI+ is only 30-odd kg lighter than the Golf GTI DSG 230ps - considering the size difference, it has to be just as sturdy unless the Polo has a Lead floorpan.

Not looking through rose tinted specs at the Polo at all - I have both the Golf and Polo and they definitely look and feel built to the same standard, albeit the Golf has a marginally nicer set of door cards and inserts.

[Leif]

As far as I know the Polo, Fabia and Ibiza are built on the same MQB platform, with the same engines, gearbox and electrics, but with different trim levels, different body panels, and different interiors. Thus one model might not have one particular engine variant, or might add some extra options not available on other models. The Audi A1 is basically the same too.

As for Eastern European cars, my Up was built in Eastern Europe (Slovakia) and was faultless for six years until I sold it. A solid well designed and built car, albeit basic.

[mike sel]

WOW 15 years in good service that car must have been well maintained.

[AndyGTi]

It’s a commonly held misconception that the A1, Fabia, Ibiza and Polo are built in the same platform. This is age dependent and when models have been released.

So a 2018 Polo and Ibiza are both on MQB A0 platform.
The Forthcoming A1 will be on the new MQB A0 platform.

However the face lifted Fabia which has just come out is still on PQ25 platform. (this was the platform for previous A1, previous Polo and previous Ibiza.)

The new Fabia which I think isn’t due until 2020 may not be on MQB either as the last think I read suggested a mix of PQ25 and MQB (I’m not an engineer so don’t shoot me if this is wrong. However I was surprised to see this info as I thought it was a straight transfer to newest platform as and when new model due)

Finally on the issue of interior quality perceived or otherwise. On the last visit to VW dealer I sat in Polo, Golf, TRoc and Tiguan. It was interesting that golf and Tiguan both “felt” the better place than the two newest additions.

I normally start my car buying process with being open minded and check out all the opposition but in all previous cases esp. on interior quality a feel, I end up with VW. There are a lot of issues quality, feel, cost cutting that I won’t go into but the next car probably will be VW.

Thanks

Andy

[monkeyhanger]

Finally on the issue of interior quality perceived or otherwise. On the last visit to VW dealer I sat in Polo, Golf, TRoc and Tiguan. It was interesting that golf and Tiguan both “felt” the better place than the two newest additions.

Thanks

Andy

It's very superficial, a bit more embellishment on the interior. In all honesty, how much more would it cost for VW to have brought the interior up to the Golf's standards? The only things it is really lacking is perhaps matching door opener insert/surround in the back as is in the front, the central twin vent surround (in front of the gear lever on the dash) could've been glossy piano black to match the instrument surround, a bit of cloth on the door cards behind the grab handle, the grab handles could be a smidge softer finish and the uppermost strip on the door cards could be rubberised to match the dash. If all that would cost VW more than £30 to add £100 to the list price, i'd be amazed. I'd pay the extra £100 to have it too.


Of course, with the Polo getting so big, there needs to be a small gap so people don't stop buying Golfs that are using older tech and are nearing the end of their model lifecycle, while the Polo is new, fresh and bristling with the kind of dash tech that the MK8 Golf will undoubtedly come with. The practicality differences between the new Polo and the current Golf are tiny. The Golf is marginally bigger, but there's a mere 11mm extra legroom in the back of the Golf than the Polo for the passenger sitting behind me when I have the drivers seat adjusted the way I like it. The seats are marginally wider in the Golf.

The Tiguan gets a whole load of headroom that neither the Golf or Polo have.

[mike sel]

Finally on the issue of interior quality perceived or otherwise. On the last visit to VW dealer I sat in Polo, Golf, TRoc and Tiguan. It was interesting that golf and Tiguan both “felt” the better place than the two newest additions.

Thanks

Andy

It's very superficial, a bit more embellishment on the interior. In all honesty, how much more would it cost for VW to have brought the interior up to the Golf's standards? The only things it is really lacking is perhaps matching door opener insert/surround in the back as is in the front, the central twin vent surround (in front of the gear lever on the dash) could've been glossy piano black to match the instrument surround, a bit of cloth on the door cards behind the grab handle, the grab handles could be a smidge softer finish and the uppermost strip on the door cards could be rubberised to match the dash. If all that would cost VW more than £30 to add £100 to the list price, i'd be amazed. I'd pay the extra £100 to have it too.


Of course, with the Polo getting so big, there needs to be a small gap so people don't stop buying Golfs that are using older tech and are nearing the end of their model lifecycle, while the Polo is new, fresh and bristling with the kind of dash tech that the MK8 Golf will undoubtedly come with. The practicality differences between the new Polo and the current Golf are tiny. The Golf is marginally bigger, but there's a mere 11mm extra legroom in the back of the Golf than the Polo for the passenger sitting behind me when I have the drivers seat adjusted the way I like it. The seats are marginally wider in the Golf.

The Tiguan gets a whole load of headroom that neither the Golf or Polo have.

Re the interior quality, I suppose ever few quid helps sell the car? I am certain that if VW wanted too they could make the polo interior exactly the same standard as the current Golf for a minimal cost. I think your right with felt lined door pockets as well. My friend has a 67 plate Audi Q2 sport with STronic auto, sound system upgrade and driver mode. I did sit in it and have a drive before choosing my POLO. The quality of the interior of the Q2 is impressive. the 1.4 evo engine is equally so. I then thought about purchasing one, I looked at the 1.0l Sline. Then the Polo (My VW dealer only had the SE in January). VW loaned me the new Polo SE 95hp for the day. We drove home to see if it was easily parked, it was, we then drove to friends to see what they thought compared to the Q2.

My friend and I used a laser measure to measure the head room on both cars and the boot size, shoulder room all front and back. We all then sat in both in turn the we all went for a drive in both (these are life long friends from school). In short the polo although being smaller outside (particularly in length and height). the Polo offered more shoulder and hear room in the back, in the front they were so close to being the same size that it did not matter, the boot was bigger in the Q2. the quality in front was better in the Q2 but not so you would choose one over the other. the quality in the back was better in the Q2 plain and simple.

Drive noise was about the same, ride quality I think we all thought the Polo was smoother. Economy the 1l polo won out over their 1.4 evo (to be expected). Acceleration the Q2 with its 1.4 evo hands down. Generally we felt that if you were not going to use the back seats very often then the POLO was a cheaper purchase that offered about the same level of comfort. We thought if the polo were an SEL 115 dsg with heated seats , some driver aids and the digi dash then the quality in the front (apart from the soft plastics on the door card) then the POLO would be hard to argue either way. If you needed to use the rear seats on a regular basis then the Q2 does win out. Obviously the elephant in the room was the higher seating position of the Q2 and it was easier to simply slide into where as the Polo we felt you sat down into it. So for them the Q2 choice was for them. The lower driving position in the Polo actually attracted us. So not I have the polo sel dsg 115 with loads of options we compared the two cars last night, the Polo was more high tech with the digi dash, the Q2 white controls lights looked more classy then the multi colour lights in the polo. other then the driving height it was impossible to argue that one car was more desirable than the other.

[Leif]

It’s a commonly held misconception that the A1, Fabia, Ibiza and Polo are built in the same platform. This is age dependent and when models have been released.

I would have thought it was obvious I was referring to current models.

So a 2018 Polo and Ibiza are both on MQB A0 platform.
The Forthcoming A1 will be on the new MQB A0 platform.

Yes, I mis-typed, the new Audi A1 has been announced but is not yet available. They will take orders soon, if not already.

However the face lifted Fabia which has just come out is still on PQ25 platform. (this was the platform for previous A1, previous Polo and previous Ibiza.)

I'm sure I read a review that said the Fabia was on the MQB platform, but apparently it is on a hybrid of the MQB and an older one, the PQ25, which they call the PQ26.

The new Fabia which I think isn’t due until 2020 may not be on MQB either as the last think I read suggested a mix of PQ25 and MQB (I’m not an engineer so don’t shoot me if this is wrong. However I was surprised to see this info as I thought it was a straight transfer to newest platform as and when new model due)

Finally on the issue of interior quality perceived or otherwise. On the last visit to VW dealer I sat in Polo, Golf, TRoc and Tiguan. It was interesting that golf and Tiguan both “felt” the better place than the two newest additions.

I normally start my car buying process with being open minded and check out all the opposition but in all previous cases esp. on interior quality a feel, I end up with VW. There are a lot of issues quality, feel, cost cutting that I won’t go into but the next car probably will be VW.

Thanks

Andy

Yes better to be open minded.