Weird ticking noise on startup - POLO 2013 TSI 1.2 105HP

[moshiaiz]

Hi,

I have a Polo 6R 2013 with 1.2 TSI 105HP engine. I have a weird knocking/ticking noise especially on cold starts.




You can hear it for around 1-2 seconds... do you know what it might be? It's been around 2 years since I first heard it.

Thanks!

[moshiaiz]

Anyone?

[iichel]

Sounds like the 'regular' chain tensioner that needs to fill up with oil. I wouldn't worry too much.

[moshiaiz]

Thanks for the reply mate.

This noise only started after 3 years or so with the car. Before that, there weren't any weird rattles at cold start. Is it still normal?

When they heard it at the dealer's, they told me I should replace the chain. But it doesn't sound like the 'famous' chain noise on this engine so I passed.

[moshiaiz]

Hi,

I've recorded a other video of this noise. Is it normal?
https://youtu.be/7EzDWMgej4w

Please advise. Thanks.

[wolfie]

From the video's yours looks like a CBZ engine and unfortunately even when they are in good health they sound tinny and rattly, far from VW's best effort. The "Ticky" sound that you hear in your earlier video's is just normal. Likewise as has been said the little rattle immediately after start-up is just the chain tensioner coming up to pressure. Issues with chain tend to be far more of a 'Rasp' and last a bit longer. Plus at 2013 you should the improved chain anyway.

The "Knock" that disappears after a few seconds does sound a bit odd. I can't say as I've noticed it on mine. But I've not stood under the bonnet and listened to it on start-up. How many miles have you done, and when was the last service/oil-change?

Also might be worth checking the oil filter. It was updated quite early on but the older versions are still being sold and fitted. Newer version has improved non-return valve. 03C 115 561 D.

[moshiaiz]

Hi,

Car just had 60000 miles and oil service was 3 days ago. I recorded the last video yesterday.
I'm from Israel and we've had a very hot week and I've been hearing those knocks for 3 days straight at the afternoon (after the car has been standing for 9+- hours)
In the winter most of the times it sounded like the first videos.
I have this issue for 3 years already. Every mechanic that hears this says they're unsure and wants to try replacing the chain. But does this sound like the chain or tensioner? On other forum I was told it might be the Hydraulic tappets.

Ill check the oil filter but I'm pretty sure they use the correct one here.

Thanks.

[moshiaiz]

Just checked on the receipt and it says 03C 115 561 H for the oil filter.

[wolfie]

Just checked on the receipt and it says 03C 115 561 H for the oil filter.

That's the correct one...

[Jay-Jay]

From the sound of the last video, it sounds like oil tappets empty of oil during the first seconds of work.
The stretched timing chain rattle is totally different.

I wouldn't worry too much if that knock doen't get worse. Just make sure to replace oil and oil filter regularly (every year or 15.000km is a good choise for the 1.2TSI 8v engine) and to use a very good quality oil (Motul, Valvoline, etc.).
Consider also to use an oil with more viscosity like a 5W40, especially during hot season.

[moshiaiz]

Hi,

I'm using Eurol 5W40 oil.
I'm just wondering why I didn't have that noise in the first 2-3 years with the car... Is this normal that oil tappets are empty on startup?
BTW when the noise started, 3 years ago, it was less frequent. Now I hear it on almost every start. Especially on hot season (which is very long in Israel).

Thanks for your help.

[Jay-Jay]

I've been able to listen to the other videos on your YouTube channel only now.
That's the sound of the timing chain knocking on the tensioner's guide, because the tensioner is not full of oil in the first seconds at startup.
It's not bad like the stretched timing chain rattle you can listen in other videos on YouTube, bur certainly it's a symptom of a problem and with time it could potentially cause other problems.
You said your engine has been produced in 2013, so it already has the last chain's design.
But in 2015 the tensioner has been updated (the part n. has moved from "03F109507D" to "03F109507F").
So, what I suggest you is to buy a new revised tensioner from VW and replace yours!

[wolfie]

Just looking this morning. 03F 109 507 F looks like it is another part number that changes for Skoda and not VW. (why VW are not as up to date is beyond me )

VW still lists 03F 109 507 D. I suspect version 'D' & 'F' may actually be the same part and possibly just have a different point of manufacture??? (It would be helpful if VW had some clarity in the way they use their part numbers.)

Eg:- Oil filters 03C 115 561 D - 03C 115 561 H - 03C 115 561 J. Appear to be the same part, yet different numbers. It doesn't help when you are trying to source the correct bits to fix something. Also they do not go in logical order A..B..C..D

Eg chain updates. 03F 109 158 B - 03F 109 158 K - 03F 109 158 G - 03F 109 158 J

Same with the cam chain 03F 109 158 G. But now a 03F 109 158 J has appeared in some repair kits.

[Jay-Jay]

wolfie, the tensioner has been updated from 03F109507D to 03F109507F in VW too!
I've just checked on the just updated ETKA on pc.
When you open the 1.2 TSI CBZ* timing chain components section, the parts list still shows the tensioner with the old part number, BUT when you double-click on it, in the new window that shows up it's written that in middle 2015 that tensioner is not more produced and that you need to order 03F109507F tensioner.

I remember that you can see the same in online ETKA at ifinterface.com.

As soon as I get back home, I'll post few screenshots.

[wolfie]

It's OK, mate you're all good.

I just followed your guide. As you say when you examine the part there is additional information in following window. It is odd how they list bits. Generally if it's updated in goes inside brackets (X) with a date. I will make sure I examine the part not just the list from here on in.

Thanks